Bashing Damage Numbers!

BorminchiaBorminchia Member Posts: 28 ✭✭
edited February 19 in Sparring Grounds
Howdy y'all. I just started playing Teradrim and have been enjoying bashing out areas and finding quests. There has also been a lot of dying. No really, probably too much dying.

Anyway, I've been looking at my bashing numbers and have been growing more and more curious where the DPS lands compared to other classes. The damage itself seems pretty good, but comes at what feels like a very long balance time.

I'm currently only level 82, which puts me somewhere around halfway through Fabled in the Hunting skill. I'm trans Terramancy (and all other guild/main skills). I also haven't picked up the balance enhance since I am honestly a little scared about losing 6% HP.

My flail stats are: Damage: 177 Penetration: 90 Speed: 70

I'm not quite sure if it is efficient to have a high damage flail due to recent changes, but there really aren't any other choices in shops right now.

I'm using the stonefury defense along with the blue ink inscription since it seems to be the best for bashing. And I spam momentum when I can.

It just so happens to be a low strength day due to the stars, so my strength is currently at 14. With all that said, my damage with the Skullbash ability is 1566 at 4.36s balance. That drops to 3.49s with momentum. So about 359 DPS without momentum, 448 with. If my math is right, being 7% faster with the +bal enhancement would put my speed at 4.06s/3.26s, and my DPS at ~385/480.

So, I'm curious to see what damage numbers and balance times are for other classes. I also wouldn't mind learning what some of the variables are for other classes and how that can affect their DPS. And finally if there are any other Tera out there that might have suggestions on how (or if) my numbers could be better.

I'm also technically pretty curious about PVP damage numbers/speed, but maybe that's a significantly more complicated post for a future date.
«13

Comments

  • IazamatIazamat Member Posts: 250 ✭✭✭✭
    I just so happen to have bashing numbers (with +bal) based on the most recent changes for Teradrim: https://ada-young.com/pastebin/Nl3oQUY3

    For those who can't click:

    177dmg/70spd flail = DMG

    70dmg/177spd flail = SPD

    17STR, Hunt 2
    --
    Batter (SPD): 509 @ 2.26s, 225.2dps

    Skullbash (SPD): 731 @ 3.19s, 229.2dps

    Batter (DMG): 1205 @ 2.75s, 438.2dps

    Skullbash (DMG): 1726 @ 3.68s, 469dps
    --
    17STR, Hunt 2, Stonefury Imbue
    --
    Batter (SPD): 585 @ 2.59s, 225.9dps

    Skullbash (SPD): 840 @ 3.66s, 229.5dps

    Batter (DMG): 1387 @ 3.16s, 438.9dps

    Skullbash (DMG): 1985 @ 4.23s, 469.3dps
    --
    17STR, Hunt 2, Stonefury Imbue, Blue Major Runemark
    --
    Batter (SPD): 634 @ 2.48s, 255.6dps

    Skullbash (SPD): 908 @ 3.51s, 258.7dps

    Batter (DMG): 1498 @ 3.03s, 494.4dps

    Skullbash (DMG): 2145 @ 4.05s, 529.6dps
    HawaMephistoles
  • IazamatIazamat Member Posts: 250 ✭✭✭✭
    I was really hoping more people would jump on sharing numbers. It'd be nice to see how classes stack up and what classes could use improvements.
    Zaila
  • BorminchiaBorminchia Member Posts: 28 ✭✭
    edited February 20
    Iazamat said:

    I just so happen to have bashing numbers (with +bal) based on the most recent changes for Teradrim: https://ada-young.com/pastebin/Nl3oQUY3

    For those who can't click:

    177dmg/70spd flail = DMG

    70dmg/177spd flail = SPD

    17STR, Hunt 2
    --
    Batter (SPD): 509 @ 2.26s, 225.2dps

    Skullbash (SPD): 731 @ 3.19s, 229.2dps

    Batter (DMG): 1205 @ 2.75s, 438.2dps

    Skullbash (DMG): 1726 @ 3.68s, 469dps
    --
    17STR, Hunt 2, Stonefury Imbue
    --
    Batter (SPD): 585 @ 2.59s, 225.9dps

    Skullbash (SPD): 840 @ 3.66s, 229.5dps

    Batter (DMG): 1387 @ 3.16s, 438.9dps

    Skullbash (DMG): 1985 @ 4.23s, 469.3dps
    --
    17STR, Hunt 2, Stonefury Imbue, Blue Major Runemark
    --
    Batter (SPD): 634 @ 2.48s, 255.6dps

    Skullbash (SPD): 908 @ 3.51s, 258.7dps

    Batter (DMG): 1498 @ 3.03s, 494.4dps

    Skullbash (DMG): 2145 @ 4.05s, 529.6dps


    Wow, the craziest thing about those numbers is that the stonefury buff basically doesn't increase your DPS at all. The AB should just say 'you'll do the same DPS but be 20% slower'.

    In fact, it seems a bit redundant to have two skills. Why not just have the blue major rune increase the damage/decrease the balance for the two bashing skills, batter and skullbash? I suppose that could increase the damage in PvP if you're willing to switch to blue rune when using those abilities, but it seems like red rune is better for the limb damage. Plus, if people are using high speed flails for PvP for efficient limb damage, the actual damage increase might be minimal depending on how much flail abilities do in PvP. I suppose I haven't played around with PvP at all so there could be some damage route I don't know about.

    It also seems like Tera will have to carry around a max speed flail to make breaking limbs efficient in PvP, while also carrying around a max damage flail for PvE for max DPS. I kind of avoided Carnifex because I wasn't excited about bouncing between two weapons (among other reasons), although my understanding is that you can at least pick one and stick with it for both PvP and PvE. With the changes making weapon stats matter for Terramancy, I had considered getting a weapon rune (yay retirement credits). But it doesn't make sense to do so if you need a max speed flail and a max damage flail, especially since the DR at those high stats would make the rune pointless. I can't be 100% sure from these numbers, but it seems a middle range flail will likely have 100 less DPS for PvE bashing, and maybe .25 seconds slower for PvP. Not a worthwhile compromise.

    Ok, not exactly on topic, sorry. What I really wanted to do was ask about the bashing numbers for some of the other classes out there. I'm mostly curious about Wayfarer and Archivist, since those were the two other classes I was considering playing before settling on Tera. Scio and Indo were honorable mentions.

    And maybe if anyone has numbers on classes more comparable to Tera, like maybe Praenomen or Luminary? Or any other single hit, decent tank bashing classes.
  • TiurTiur Producer Member, Administrator, Immortal Posts: 921 admin
    @Keroc might chime in with some specifics to responses, but we're interested in the thread. It wasn't too long ago we tried to even out the playing field for hunting and make it more fair, so it shouldn't have drifted enough to cause any problems. Key word "shouldn't".
  • MjollMjoll Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
    edited February 22
    Artifex bashing numbers

    Damage: 179 (+32) Penetration: 89 (+18) Speed: 142 (+18)
    Rune of Bludgeoning

    21STR, hunt3 + red amulet
    -- vs mine eld (+15% damage because of salvage gauntlet)
    Doublebash: 1089*2 damage
    2.63 seconds balance
    dps 828

    Doublebash with savagery furor
    1415*2
    3.02 seconds balance
    937 dps

    Doublebash with hound openings
    1636*2
    2.63 seconds balance
    1244

    Doublebash with furor+hound openings
    2135*2
    3.02 seconds balance
    1413 dps
    Post edited by Mjoll on
  • CzciborCzcibor Member Posts: 94 ✭✭✭
    edited February 22
    Wayfarer
    190 damage, 86 speed, rune of cutting
    19 str, hunt1, red amulet, red orb
    Anthem active
    1328 @ 1.77
    750 dps
  • CzciborCzcibor Member Posts: 94 ✭✭✭
    Ascendril
    21 int, hunt3, potence3, red amulet, red orb

    Firelash-Water
    2278 @ 2.58

    Windlance-Fire
    1014 @ 1.72
    +80 * 3 for airwreath

    Frostblade-Air
    1773 @ 2.58
    +300 for frostwreath

    Total cycle
    5065 @ 6.88
    736 dps
    Total cycle counting airwreath/frostwreath
    5605 @ 6.88
    814 dps

    Firelash only
    2101 @ 2.58
    814 dps

  • IazamatIazamat Member Posts: 250 ✭✭✭✭
    Czcibor said:

    Ascendril
    21 int, hunt3, potence3, red amulet, red orb

    Wow, with the artifacts at play here, Ascendril should be doing way more damage in PvE, in my opinion.
  • CzciborCzcibor Member Posts: 94 ✭✭✭
    Oh right, my testing was not done on eld so all of that was normal damage.
  • StineStine Member Posts: 154 ✭✭✭
    Templar w/ 21 STR, red amulet/orb, 2x lvl 3 weapon rune to get these stats + 14 augments on each, hunt_templar 3
    DSK 170/93/148 and 164/110/147 - could be better if second had less pen and more damage
    1120 1112
    + 50 + 50 Sacrifice on each hit.
    -----
    2332 @ 2.32 = 1005 dps

    DSW can hit some pretty good numbers too but don't have anything set for it.
  • LinLin Blackbird The MoongladeMember Posts: 1,666 ✭✭✭✭✭
    How are you guys calculating your DPS?
  • MjollMjoll Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
    (total damage) / (balance taken)
    HavenDrystin
  • HavenHaven World Burner Flight SchoolMember Posts: 2,334 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Luminary Stats

    | Strength : 13(-1) Dexterity : 17(+2) Timeout : 20 minutes |
    | Intelligence : 12(+1) Constitution : 15(+2) Statpack : Athletic |
    Stats
    - Dexterity
    - Intelligence
    Speed
    - Balance

    Smite on Eld
    Damage done: 956, magic, brute
    Balance Used: 2.88 seconds
    DPS: 331.94

    Lightning without crown on Eld
    Damage done: 867, electric, magical
    Equilibrium Used: 3.00 seconds
    DPS: 289

    Lightning with crown on Eld
    Damage done: 867, electric, magical
    Equilibrium Used: 2.79 seconds
    DPS: 310.75

    ===========
    | Strength : 10(-1) Dexterity : 15(+2) Timeout : 20 minutes |
    | Intelligence : 16(+1) Constitution : 14(+2) Statpack : Wise |
    You have obtained the following enhancements:
    Stats
    - Intelligence
    - Dexterity
    Speed
    - Equilibrium

    Smite on Eld
    Damage done: 730, magic, brute
    Balance Used: 3.10 seconds
    DPS: 235.48

    Evoke Lighting on Eld without crown
    Damage done: 1136, electric, magical
    Equilibrium Used: 2.79 seconds
    DPS: 407.16

    Evoke Lightning on Eld with Crown
    Damage done: 1136, electric, magical
    Equilibrium Used: 2.58 seconds
    DPS: 440.31
    ==================
    | Strength : 16(+1) Dexterity : 13(+1) Timeout : 20 minutes |
    | Intelligence : 12 Constitution : 15(+2) Statpack : Powerful |
    You have obtained the following enhancements:
    Stats
    - Strength
    - Dexterity
    Speed
    - Balance

    Smite on Eld
    Damage done: 1157, magic, brute
    Balance Used: 2.88 seconds
    DPS: 401.74

    Lightning on Eld without crown
    Damage done: 867, electric, magical
    Equilibrium Used: 3.00 seconds
    DPS: 289

    Lightning on Eld with crown
    Damage done: 867, electric, magical
    Equilibrium Used: 2.79 seconds
    DPS: 310.75
    ¤ Si vis pacem, para bellum. ¤
    Someone powerful says, "We're going to have to delete you."
    havenbanner2
  • SerriceSerrice the Black Fox Member Posts: 1,228 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Lol, at 18-19 str with a level 3 on a near max damage warhammer and red orb, I'd get maybe 650 DPS or so? I can't give you numbers anymore, but the numbers you guys are putting out are insane relative to that.

    Red amulet shouldn't stack with hunt arties either, but even accounting for +5% from 21 str and +15% from hunt Templar, I can't imagine how I'd even get close to 1k DPS on Templar, never mind on any of my other classes!

    (will post real numbers later)
     
    Aeryx
  • MjollMjoll Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
    Red amulets stack with the hunt artifacts.
    DrystinMephistoles
  • SerriceSerrice the Black Fox Member Posts: 1,228 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 22
    Well, depending on various variables with your quota completing, amulets will be made available by your city ylem vendor. These
    work like low-level artifacts, but decay after a certain amount of time. They do not stack with artifacts.


    They shouldn't. If they do, that's a bug (somewhere).
     
  • SerriceSerrice the Black Fox Member Posts: 1,228 ✭✭✭✭✭
    MONK

    21 str, red orb, level 2 knuckles, Scorpion stance (highest damage boosts)

    732 + 468 + 468 = 1668 damage, 2.79s.

    597.8 DPS

    We can do some napkin math here to calculate what damage would be like with hunt_monk 3 (+15%) and level 3 knuckles (+35% to punches, vs. +25% to punches from level 2) and we'd get somewhere around 718.4 DPS, about a 20% increase. That's still wildly lower than some of the numbers I'm seeing here though!

    Remember was Sentinel was king and got nerfed into the ground? Can we see that happen again?
     
  • MjollMjoll Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
    Why not bring everyone up instead of stomping down?
    LinHawaDrystin
  • IazamatIazamat Member Posts: 250 ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 22
    Can we bring everyone up instead of nerfing bashing? I can say from experience that ~530dps at 4.05s is absolutely awful, and the "tank" isn't a worthwhile trade-off for the (lack of) speed.
    Lin
  • HavenHaven World Burner Flight SchoolMember Posts: 2,334 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Does this mean some classes need to be scaled up or down?


    ¤ Si vis pacem, para bellum. ¤
    Someone powerful says, "We're going to have to delete you."
    havenbanner2
  • SerriceSerrice the Black Fox Member Posts: 1,228 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Sure, from what I've seen on this thread, Sentinel needs a buff. Teradrim? Your numbers are about the same as mine, if we account for arti differences. Templar? That's a big ehhhhh. 1k DPS is nutty even with his investment. Ascendril looks a little higher than what I'd get with the same investment, but w/e, still within reason. Poor Haven's Luminary? He has like no strength, I'm sure his numbers would be even with all the above if he had equivalent stats.

    Carnifex? Drastic nerf, imo.
     
  • StineStine Member Posts: 154 ✭✭✭
    edited February 22
    Mjoll was testing against eld and for some reason hasn't mentioned that in this thread, which is 15% damage buff from her gauntlet.

    Same for mine, since I asked her what she was testing on.

    Edit: That is to say, the numbers are 15% higher than any other mob type.
    Mjoll
  • MjollMjoll Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
    edited February 22
    I forgot about my gauntlet giving a damage bonus on eld, I picked eld so I wouldn't have to dig for no crits on all my RNG buffs since furor's cooldown and openings few seconds of up time don't always line up. I wasn't trying to obfuscate anything or be shady :\
    Stine
  • BorminchiaBorminchia Member Posts: 28 ✭✭
    edited February 22
    Serrice said:

    Sure, from what I've seen on this thread, Sentinel needs a buff. Teradrim? Your numbers are about the same as mine, if we account for arti differences. Templar? That's a big ehhhhh. 1k DPS is nutty even with his investment. Ascendril looks a little higher than what I'd get with the same investment, but w/e, still within reason. Poor Haven's Luminary? He has like no strength, I'm sure his numbers would be even with all the above if he had equivalent stats.

    Carnifex? Drastic nerf, imo.

    Did you mean Sentaari? You mention Sentinel here and in an earlier post, but posted Monk numbers. Just wanted to clarify!

    As for Carni, it probably makes the most sense to average out Mjoll's damage because of its highs and lows. Furor only has a 25% up time (15 second duration, 1 minute CD), which means Mjoll's DPS is 937 for about 15 seconds, and then 828 for the remaning 45 seconds. That means Mjoll's overall DPS should be about 855.

    The openings buff lasts around 5 seconds. Unfortunately, I don't know how often it procs, but let's pretend an unlikely scenario occurs where it procs 3 times in a row, at the exact same time furor goes up, and then doesn't proc again for 45 seconds (in other words we're pretending it procs every 20 seconds, which might be about right). This means Mjoll's DPS is 1413 for 15 seconds, and then 828 for the remaining 45 seconds. That makes her overall DPS about 974, which ends up being less than Stine's.

    Stine technically has an extra +3 rune since he dual wields, and an amazing and hilarious 14 augments on each weapon, but their other arties basically cancel out. For Mjoll, I think there's an internal CD on the openings proc, so the above scenario is technically impossible, which means she is likely under 974 DPS. In the end, I think Carni and Templar probably do very similar damage, although it wouldn't surprise me if Carni edges out Templar a little bit. (I'm also not a mathmagician so let me know if I'm doing things wrong here!)


    Either way, I think I'd prefer to just see numbers before immediately saying class A needs buffs or class B needs nerfs.

    Also, at this point, I'm getting curious if any other classes have a 4+ second bashing attack? Most people seem to be somewhere in the 2-3s range (inb4 someone says 'lol newbie kick').
    MjollBulrokHawa
  • BulrokBulrok Member Posts: 76 ✭✭✭
    It's been pretty standard that the tankier you are the less damage you do in PvE for forever. If we're going to follow the trends of old and suggest Carnifex damage needs nerfed then I would fully expect numb, transmute, and the potential for triple vigor procs to all be looked at very carefully, and then Monk should go AT LEAST 5 real life years before they see a dps increase after their tankiness is gutted and bled dry, and not a day before Praenomen dps is increased.

    Don't forget to nerf Templar, either.
    HavenFezzix
  • HawaHawa Member Posts: 123 ✭✭✭
    edited February 22
    my numbers for indorani
    19 dexterity, +bal enhancement
    NO red orb, antiquated gauntlet, or other damage buffs
    target: eld

    bonedagger: 1647 @ 3.26s
    505.2 DPS

    as i understand it, due to a classlead a year or two ago, decay's base eq time is the same as bonedagger's base balance, and it has the same base damage and scaling as bonedagger. the relevant stat is intelligence rather than dexterity, but its DPS will work out a little bit higher if you've got both +eq enhancement and eq crown/purple amulet since the eq time sits at 3.06s, iirc.

    ETA: i forgot about Hunting Might -> i'm level 107 (46% Mythical in Hunting), so not *quite* at maximum damage potential. my memory from hunting at level 140 with 21 dex & +bal, however, was something like 1819 @ 3.26s, so my current numbers aren't wildly under what's possible at trans Hunting.

    ETA (AGAIN UGH): apparently i lied, i DO have one damage buff from a leystone. tbh idk how much of a buff it is, but there you go.
    Your city's pylon is boosting your damage.

    so sneaky smh
    (Congregation): Iosyne says, "I made a cup."

    Horkval are a feature...
    Mjoll
  • BenedictoBenedicto Tentacles Errywhere! Member Posts: 803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 22
    Temp 2h Blade
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^

    21str, hunt boon level 2, 2h blade (Damage: 163 (+18) Penetration: 90 (+18) Speed: 143 (+18) w/ lvl3 rune), red orb

    100 damage added due to sacrifice empowerment

    DSW @ 2.95s = 1020 x 2 or 2040 in total

    691 DPS

    (Leaders): Tiur says, "I'll remember not to delete you when the time comes, Bene. Good people."

    Mjoll
  • LinLin Blackbird The MoongladeMember Posts: 1,666 ✭✭✭✭✭
    A nice run-of-the-mill report:

    Sentaari, 18 Strength (+3 Strength arti and the worst stars in the universe)

    Typical SDK + UCP + UCP in Scorpion stance: 1308 damage @ 2.79 seconds

    Approx. 469 DPS.
    Mjoll
  • BorminchiaBorminchia Member Posts: 28 ✭✭
    edited February 23
    Serrice said:

    Well, depending on various variables with your quota completing, amulets will be made available by your city ylem vendor. These
    work like low-level artifacts, but decay after a certain amount of time. They do not stack with artifacts.


    They shouldn't. If they do, that's a bug (somewhere).
    I've thought about this and realized why red amulet/red orb might stack with class hunt arties. Red amulet/red orb are technically different than the class hunt arties. Class hunt arties add 5% damage per level to your abilities, specific to class. Red orb/red amulet are generic +5% damage, not dependent on your class.

    I believe the amulets that don't stack with arties are the +sip amulet, +5% health/mana amulet (same as enhancement arti), and +stats amulet.

    Edit: Also I think the purple arti does not stack with +eq. I have absoltuely no idea about green stacking with crit arties.
    Post edited by Borminchia on
  • AeryxAeryx Member Posts: 103 ✭✭✭
    edited February 23
    Zealot, 19 strength, red orb and red amulet, level 3 knuckles, zeal mindset star, no hunt artifact:

    1076 per pummel, 1076x2 = 2152

    2152 / 3.26s = 660 dps

    2152 / 2.66s(Disunion proc) = 809 dps

    Additional note: Noon day sun, because it just happened(21 str, increased balance)

    1158 per pummel, 1158x2 = 2316

    2316 / 2.77 = 836 dps

    2316 / 2.17(Disunion proc) = 1067 dps


    Additional additional note, Shapeshifter, 19 strength, red orb, red amulet, no damage artifact, no hunt artifact:

    692 per slash, 692x2 = 1384

    1384 / 2.65s = 522 dps
    Post edited by Aeryx on
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