Best Of

The only problem with everyone having access to everything prior to the tether lockdown was that certain charaters/orgs were less flexible with their RP than others, which led to some people feeling left out (Spirit, mostly, as it is difficult to justify a class like Indorani or Carnifex over there). Mechanically, it was otherwise a complete non-issue for the game and its health as a whole. This change will make it so that the mirror classes are themed properly for their respective tether and no org/tether as a whole has to make a call on whether to abandon RP for mechanical strength or lose people. Pretending that competition (healthy or otherwise), envy, or conflict will go by the wayside because of mirror classes is hugely disingenuous and, frankly, a rather bogus notion. Healthy competition and conflict (or lack thereof) definitely don't (and shouldn't) stem from class asymmetry.

However, if you're worried that you're going to see mass migration from one's tether with the advent of mirror classes, let this be a moment for introspection. Ask yourself (and those migrating or hoping to migrate) why they would leave, what can be done to prevent them leaving now or in the future, and how the tether can be improved as a whole. We have some time before the first mirror classes will be rolled out, so I hope people start looking more at how it will improve the game for everyone around them rather than continuing to make bogus claims about how it will hurt the game as a whole.

I don't think conflict will go by the wayside. I just think it's cheesy for everyone to have the same classes regardless of tether.

"If all classes are mirrored you take away the element of trying something new, which is a good feeling for anyone that has switched tethers in the past."

As somebody who in their early years of playing developed quite a side-hopping reputation because "Ooo shiny new class" temptation grew overwhelming, I'd like to note there's definitely a chunk of the playerbase that would be impacted in the opposite way - no need to swap sides and invent RP as an excuse just to play a class that's currently locked behind another tether if you're simply looking for a bit of a mechanical change to your abilities.

That said, I also think that the original clarification that these can be entirely different may have been missed there a bit. Shadow Luminaries aren't just going to summon an angel with horns and use a glowing black and red mace, and Spirit Indorani aren't going to summon the rejected entities that were too nice to make it on the Chaos Plane. The way I read it, these are going to look entirely different with very different themes, but simply have the same mechanical effects; Indorani can throw a hangedman tarot at somebody to bind them, Spirit Indorani could ensnare somebody in magical chains or something. Totally different ways of doing it aesthetically and from a roleplay perspective, but same mechanical effect in the end.

I agree that the admin will be able to make the mirrored classes make sense from an RP perspective. I'm just addressing the watering down of the uniqueness of tethers through everyone having access to every class. I don't think that will have a long time positive effect on the realms. I think efforts can be better put into the development of new and unique classes for each tether or even non-tether. I personally enjoy the uniqueness and creativeness of each class. I visualize @Keroc having a super master system that can beat anyone with any class. I think people should focus more on their individual skills. The thought behind even mirroring classes derives from the combat community. I think people have a lot of opinions without putting in the practice. To be fair both Fezzix, Benedicto and many others have dedicated years into their systems. And in my personal opinion, the key to most peoples combat failures do not lay in their offense but it's their defense. Your firstaid needs to be better developed to handle different classes and affliction strategies. The new classlead system was a surprise to me because before only Liaisons (combat leaders of classes) would take suggestions from their communities and bring them to the admin. I think the classlead system being so public is an issue because people that have not dedicated time to perfecting a class complain all the time. This is one of the core problems with multi-classing because if you notice Fezzix only fights Syssin, that's it. While others pick 5 different classes and cycle through them. Winning in combat is not about randomly selecting classes that you think can beat others. It's about taking pride in your craft and kicking behind. Honestly there are things that I haven't even added to my Zealot combat that would make it 5 times better. So until I put that work into the class and test it, I don't have any suggestions about improvements etc.

I agree that it feels like it's better, but the #1 response I've been given when polling players who quit is some perceived bias in tethers, most often combat related. Keroc adjusts one tether or class, and it's assumed it was meant to damage the tether instead of keeping the meta interesting. Mirror classes eliminate that claim entirely. I just don't see a better solution.

@Tiur I see your point. You know honestly, sometimes there is no solution. I think tethers disagreeing with each other is natural discourse between opposing sides. I do think that it could be handled in a better way OOC-wise. But I don't think that's the problem of the system, more so the problem of individuals. Even if there were to be mirrored classes - I think new problems would simply come to fruition. My only hope is that it doesn't effect the realms as a whole. This is a huge change and sometimes people don't know what's best for them. The same people polling could be the first ones to leave after changes are made. I like having sides and each side having unique abilities - regardless of how strong i may feel the other side is vice versa. Competition and a little bit of envy for the other side is healthy in my opinion.

I would prefer the efforts to be directed toward the creation of new non-tethered classes and expanding upon the idea of factions. I think this creates more meaningful RP and allows people to choose between tethers based off the unique qualities of each tether.

I do not support the idea of mirroring tethers because I believe each tether provides something unique and your personal decision of what tether you associate with is because of the unique qualities and skills you enjoy within that tether.

I see mirroring as "watering" down tethers and trying to create a big community of people that all have the same thing. In life people don't have the same thing. There's value in the conflict and envy that each tether has for one another. Let's keep that decision real and with consequences.

I think overtime if everyone had every class then I could see people leaving tethers purely because of politics and not because of the desire to try something new. If all classes are mirrored you take away the element of trying something new, which is a good feeling for anyone that has switched tethers in the past.

I recognize the obvious financial benefits for the realms because now people could and would buy more classes, but I feel it to be the lazier approach that could have negative consequences on the overall value of aetolia. Obviously a big issue is the between-tether arguments during liaisons and I understand the work that @Keroc has to involve himself in - in order to making everyone happy - which the player base could be more cognizant of this and not add so much stress onto everyone one of @Keroc 's decisions.

But... I would rather efforts be focused on the creation of new classes and keeping tethers separate. The idea that everyone needs to be the same is not a good idea. The idea that everyone needs to be the same is balanced is not how the world operates. Imbalance in some ways is actually good because it challenges all of us to improve and work toward "the idea" of balance. If you give everyone the same thing you lose that element of working toward something which could result in disinterest.

As weird as it may sound, imbalances actually keep us alive and keeps us improving and keeps us interested.

Just my 2 cents! Thanks