Teradrim, A not very Earthen experience

Iazamat

I'll be honest, the "we don't want to be the Carnifex, they're just PKers!" rhetoric sounds more like jealousy than anything and a very distinct fear that Teradrim being popular would mean it's harder for those passing this rhetoric around to maintain the control they've traditionally had in the org. Call it bias, but Carnifex have been one of the healthier and more popular orgs in the past few years and there are very clear reasons for that. I'm not saying you need to be the Carnifex, but you should certainly be looking at why that is and seeking to emulate it in ways applicable to your org where possible.

Tetchta

I killed Jhin with a soul reave twice in a row, stop trying to understate our power.

Kurak

I have always viewed a guild as an rp contract, we are agreeing to a theme to all center around. I feel what being a Teradrim is about was lost somewhere down the road. I had an ooc conversation with a Teradrim leader recently were it was pointed out that Teradrim have not always been warlike and that this 'new take' is modern artifice. And some of the membership(leaders) do not like that more 'modern' view. But from my reading of rather old books and checking older news posts "Strength!" has been our thing for long time. Teradrim are kin to the Earthen which war constantly amongst themselves. We should be an Earthen tribe that comes in an avalanche of religious fury, stone, gore and blood. Instead of whatever weird thing we have currently become. None of this takes PK! But PK should always be encouraged and supported. But you can still represent the guild by just having decent rp and understanding our theme.

I do believe the anti-Carnifex sentiment in our guild is pure jealousy and projection.

Iesid

Alela said:

so like, anyways, uh, there are far worse things that could happen to a guild than becoming "like the Carnifex." maybe give it a try?

Iazamat said:

[...] I'm not saying you need to be the Carnifex, but you should certainly be looking at why that is and seeking to emulate it in ways applicable to your org where possible.

A guild doesn't become and stay large out of coincidence. A guild does not become or stay small out of coincidence, either. You both are absolutely correct that smaller or less active guilds could learn a thing or two from larger ones like the Carnifex. When the Sentinels were in a spot of trouble, I made an alt in the Carnifex to understand what was going on inside that made you guys so effective and popular. My hope was that I would see something you were doing that I could emulate or get some ideas from. Lo and behold, I had a lot of healthy takeaways that I ended up bringing before the rest of the guild leadership in modified manners.

It sounds like people are unwilling to take that wisdom from the Carnifex specifically because it is the Carnifex providing it, which is petty and has no place in an organization struggling to maintain health and culture.

Kurak said:

I have always viewed a guild as an rp contract, we are agreeing to a theme to all center around.

Absolutely, without a doubt. In addition, my belief is that the more prominently you are displayed on a guild's HELP file, the more you need to act as a living, breathing embodiment of that guild's intended RP. It's clear what the admin intends for the Teradrim - so the leadership in question needs to step up and begin acting that out instead of resisting it. My opinion has always been that the core role of a guildmaster is to be an absolute example of that 'intended RP' in all ways, not just the ways you happen to like. This allows people to take cues and put their own spin on things while understanding the boundaries and necessity. Without an example, nobody really understands how to fulfill the social contract of guild roleplay - or, they need to struggle for other ways to get that example.

Kurak said:

[...] I had an ooc conversation with a Teradrim leader recently were it was pointed out that Teradrim have not always been warlike and that this 'new take' is modern artifice. And some of the membership(leaders) do not like that more 'modern' view. [...]

Sure sounds like they shouldn't be leaders, then. After all, leaders are meant to usher their orgs through the era - not plant their feet in and hope they can get away with starving a guild out of its intended RP/culture. People who forcibly keep an organization rooted in the past (and in this case, that past is kind of a fabrication) do not belong in leadership.

Tetchta

I'm not sure how the Teradrim Aren't Warlike ethos ever survived; their entire foundational lore is that they're the jailors of some of the most dangerous entities to ever exist (Both the Sorcerer-Kings and Baugluckgluck9000), as well as protectors of the Pillars in general, which are more less so important to Sapience (at least from their perspective, and their lore seems pretty substantive when it comes to veracity) which kind of has an inherently violent subtext to it. Jailors aren't peaceful entities, and basically can only do their job under the contstant threat of physical force. Same for guards of something so important. Security guards of important things generally will shoot you dead if you try to mess with what they're guarding.

That's all ignoring the undead thing, which is kind of inherently...aggressive, if not overtly violent, in the sense that it stands opposite to the Cycle, and basically is an ever-present standing challenge to the established order of nature.

If anything, I think that the Earthcaller lore was introduced to make this mandate more explicit, and to make some of this Warrior-prone philosophy more clear. It's definitely not out of left field, and anybody who thinks that the themes of the Teradrim weren't that of violent warriors hasn't been paying attention.


---

More on topic, though, I think every guild should listen to the experiences of new members and should be ready to change stuff if it's not working. The Carnifex, while a version of a Decently Healthy Guild, also is not perfect by any means. Cultivating the player experience of the guild has been more or less an ever-evolving process, and any guild that falls asleep thinking that they're Perfect or Done doing that sort of thing is basically asking for the guild to fall to pieces. In fact, the overall dip in numbers aside that happened last year, you can pretty much trace dips in the Carnifex numbers directly with periods of leadership checking out in some way (this happened quite a lot in 2020 and 2021, and I don't blame a single person for it.) Ebbs and flows are definitely just a thing that will happen in a guild over time--but if you find that you're All Ebb and No Flow, something's wrong with your org and you better start looking into it.

Seurimas

Iesid said:

Sure sounds like they shouldn't be leaders, then. After all, leaders are meant to usher their orgs through the era - not plant their feet in and hope they can get away with starving a guild out of its intended RP/culture. People who forcibly keep an organization rooted in the past (and in this case, that past is kind of a fabrication) do not belong in leadership.

I disagree with this. If a leader doesn't like the "intended" RP, they are not required to push that RP. They should not push it in the complete opposite direction, because that's likely to confuse and annoy newbies, members, peers, and admin alike, but the HELP file is not the final word on guild RP. It is, however, incumbent upon them to push things somewhere specific and appealing to their membership.

I have sat and mulled over how to handle these culture problems in my guild. I thought that maybe with consistent rp I could help right the guild. I have no want for a leadership position, this post is coming from a genuine place of frustration with the ooc leadership metagaming in my guild.

However, if you see "leadership" not pushing RP you want, and are stymied in efforts to push that RP from a non-leadership position, you should consider leadership for yourself. Elections are nominally how players take control of organizational RP, not forum posts. It's okay not to "want" to be the leader, but you clearly want at least part of the privileges of that position. If you're not ready to take the responsibilities, too, what are you actually offering to your guild?

I don't know if RP is the specific concern here, though. It sounds like there's some subpar goal design (125 lessers? 25 majors? That's... intense, even for a dedicated PKer), and a lot of PK anxiety. I agree with the idea that no one should be forced to PK if they don't want to, but it should be okay to: require people to know some essentials, like how curing and their skills work; expect a small amount of token group PK for higher ranks (3-5 lessers, probably no majors); and be a big ol' brute, even if the rest of the guild is not. Syssin are conscientious about supporting all types of players, and it sounds like we're not the only ones. That includes supporting PKers, non-PKers, old guard, new guard, and especially newbies. If you find yourself short on a certain kind of player, you should ask yourself what you might be doing to chase those players away, and "it just doesn't fit our RP" is never a valid answer.

Tetchta

Seurimas said:

However, if you see "leadership" not pushing RP you want, and are stymied in efforts to push that RP from a non-leadership position, you should consider leadership for yourself.

This is ostensibly a good suggestion, but there are definitely organizations that are in a place where they trickle out new members at a steady-but-slow-enough rate (their outflow numbers probably don't actually look all that bad on paper in this sense), so they never build any real equity in the org, and so when elections come up, there's never a real change, because everyone who's a newbie has bailed ages ago so they can better spend their time doing something Actually Fun. All that ends up remaining, therefore, is 90% of the status quo that got the org there in the first place, 5% of people who want to maybe change it, and 5% who don't care either way (and therefore usually vote for the status quo).


"If you don't like it, take charge" only works in a system where the orgs are healthy enough that people stick around in any number reasonable enough for voting while also caring enough about the org's health to keep tabs on that sorta thing.

Kurak

Seurimas said:

Iesid said:

Sure sounds like they shouldn't be leaders, then. After all, leaders are meant to usher their orgs through the era - not plant their feet in and hope they can get away with starving a guild out of its intended RP/culture. People who forcibly keep an organization rooted in the past (and in this case, that past is kind of a fabrication) do not belong in leadership.

I disagree with this. If a leader doesn't like the "intended" RP, they are not required to push that RP. They should not push it in the complete opposite direction, because that's likely to confuse and annoy newbies, members, peers, and admin alike, but the HELP file is not the final word on guild RP. It is, however, incumbent upon them to push things somewhere specific and appealing to their membership.

I have sat and mulled over how to handle these culture problems in my guild. I thought that maybe with consistent rp I could help right the guild. I have no want for a leadership position, this post is coming from a genuine place of frustration with the ooc leadership metagaming in my guild.

However, if you see "leadership" not pushing RP you want, and are stymied in efforts to push that RP from a non-leadership position, you should consider leadership for yourself. Elections are nominally how players take control of organizational RP, not forum posts. It's okay not to "want" to be the leader, but you clearly want at least part of the privileges of that position. If you're not ready to take the responsibilities, too, what are you actually offering to your guild?

I don't know if RP is the specific concern here, though. It sounds like there's some subpar goal design (125 lessers? 25 majors? That's... intense, even for a dedicated PKer), and a lot of PK anxiety. I agree with the idea that no one should be forced to PK if they don't want to, but it should be okay to: require people to know some essentials, like how curing and their skills work; expect a small amount of token group PK for higher ranks (3-5 lessers, probably no majors); and be a big ol' brute, even if the rest of the guild is not. Syssin are conscientious about supporting all types of players, and it sounds like we're not the only ones. That includes supporting PKers, non-PKers, old guard, new guard, and especially newbies. If you find yourself short on a certain kind of player, you should ask yourself what you might be doing to chase those players away, and "it just doesn't fit our RP" is never a valid answer.

I do agree with you. But the problem with the Teradrim is not simply an 'rp problem'. In fact, an rp problem alone would be tolerable and easier to handle.

Iesid

Seurimas said:

Iesid said:

Sure sounds like they shouldn't be leaders, then. After all, leaders are meant to usher their orgs through the era - not plant their feet in and hope they can get away with starving a guild out of its intended RP/culture. People who forcibly keep an organization rooted in the past (and in this case, that past is kind of a fabrication) do not belong in leadership.

I disagree with this. If a leader doesn't like the "intended" RP, they are not required to push that RP. They should not push it in the complete opposite direction, because that's likely to confuse and annoy newbies, members, peers, and admin alike, but the HELP file is not the final word on guild RP. It is, however, incumbent upon them to push things somewhere specific and appealing to their membership.

Org cultures on the level we are discussing are handed down by admin. If their intention for the org isn't the correct one that you should be following, then whose exactly is?

If they aren't down with what the admin intends for their org, they shouldn't be the one steering the ship. That's like working in cargo delivery and complaining that you have to deliver your goods to a town you don't like. You signed up to do the delivery, so do it or let someone else have the job.

Tetchta

Iesid said:

Org cultures on the level we are discussing are handed down by admin. If their intention for the org isn't the correct one that you should be following, then whose exactly is?

If they aren't down with what the admin intends for their org, they shouldn't be the one steering the ship. That's like working in cargo delivery and complaining that you have to deliver your goods to a town you don't like. You signed up to do the delivery, so do it or let someone else have the job.

I think it's alright to deviate from mandated cultures for guilds, probably even quite a bit. Still, there's probably a reasonable limit to how far that can go. The Dominion is never going to be able to swing a philosophical switch where they become compatible with Enorian without some sort of intervention in game, I'd like to think.

I'm generally a pretty big proponent of player agency with regards to how orgs are structured, so I def think "what the admin want the org to be" has to be pretty broad and allow for many interpretations. But yeah, you shouldn't be an org leader (or really IN an org) where your character is completely at odds with what the central concete is. I can't imagine a Carnifex being able to swing an anti-soul-exploitation angle very successfully for example. And someone trying to work against the core themes of the Tera really doesn't have TOO much leeway, considering the central concete more or less would require betraying their duties to protect the pillars if they did such a thing. Would practically undo half their skillsets.

Seurimas

Iesid said:

Org cultures on the level we are discussing are handed down by admin. If their intention for the org isn't the correct one that you should be following, then whose exactly is?

If they aren't down with what the admin intends for their org, they shouldn't be the one steering the ship. That's like working in cargo delivery and complaining that you have to deliver your goods to a town you don't like. You signed up to do the delivery, so do it or let someone else have the job.

It's not a job, though. It's a game. Admin obviously have the last word on a lot of things, but players should have and do have more autonomy than this. This is doubly true because you signed up for a lot more than being at the admin's beck and call.

Iesid

Seurimas said:

Iesid said:

Org cultures on the level we are discussing are handed down by admin. If their intention for the org isn't the correct one that you should be following, then whose exactly is?

If they aren't down with what the admin intends for their org, they shouldn't be the one steering the ship. That's like working in cargo delivery and complaining that you have to deliver your goods to a town you don't like. You signed up to do the delivery, so do it or let someone else have the job.

It's not a job, though. It's a game. Admin obviously have the last word on a lot of things, but players should have and do have more autonomy than this. This is doubly true because you signed up for a lot more than being at the admin's beck and call.

When I said the word 'job', I was expressly referring to my metaphor. Of course being a GM/CL/OH isn't a job. It's a volunteer position.

I don't think 'autonomy' is an excuse to not promote the intended themes and cultures of your org. Autonomy is what allows you to exercise your creative freedom inside the boundaries of what is handed down to you by the admin. What has been illustrated here, to me, indicates a complete unwillingness to work within those lines aside from vague usage of the word 'Earth'.

Tetchta

It's a responsibility. One you can easily walk away from at any time with no risk to your person or livelihood.

Seurimas

Iesid said:

When I said the word 'job', I was expressly referring to my metaphor. Of course being a GM/CL/OH isn't a job. It's a volunteer position.

I don't think 'autonomy' is an excuse to not promote the intended themes and cultures of your org. Autonomy is what allows you to exercise your creative freedom inside the boundaries of what is handed down to you by the admin. What has been illustrated here, to me, indicates a complete unwillingness to work within those lines aside from vague usage of the word 'Earth'.

I understood that just fine. What I'm getting at is those boundaries are not as hard set or precisely defined as what's in the help files, and your responsibility to pursue RP within those boundaries is secondary to creating a fun environment for yourself and others. That should be informed by admin-written RP, but you can sparingly swing wildly afield of many of those specifics.

That said, I don't see how most of these issues are a failing to tread those RP lines. There seems to mostly be some cultural issues, like exclusion of newbies and poor IC/OOC divides.

Lim

So anyway, a huge congratulations to Nipsy, kudos and respect to Fyrren, and all the best to the Teradrim. May this be a new era forward and that we get to really see the Teradrim add to the Aetolia story. 

Nipsy

CLOSE THIS THREAD A NEW DEPUTY IS IN TOWN.

Unless I royally screw it up then you can re-open it.
Also thank you @Fyrren for being supportive and encouraging, and allowing me to take over as Imperator.
I don't like unicornsing making promises, but I'll be a man of my word.

Now show me all the lore nerd, ritual stuff you got, I am waiting to see what you got up those sleeves.


ALSO CHAINS AREN'T BUGGED ANYMORE, WHEN THE RANKS GOT CHANGED IT MESSED UP THE PROG I THINK. (I fix)


Also, lots of scrolls to update, be patient with me.

Ruqayya

Hi, I'm new to Aetolia and wanted to be a dirt person so I joined the Teradrim. Ever since work started, my hours have become terrible, as I'm only able to give my full attention to the game once most people have gone to sleep. Before that, I didn't see much RP around and thought the guild itself to be quiet, although Fyrren and the others did their best to answer any relevant questions I had.

While we're on the topic, I've never been invited to any OOC Teradrim Discord servers and I don't plan on joining any because, based on experience, the worst thing you can do is join an unmoderated server for a MUD.

I came from a very RP-heavy game so I'm still adjusting to the lack of interaction that happens coming across people wherever but I understand that not everybody prefers to RP in the same way as I do and not everybody is interested in RPing with me, period. As a result, I've been keeping an open mind, observing the RP culture in Aetolia, and just operating in my little RP bubble, putting together my own Teradrim/Earthcaller RP despite there not being any regular earth-kissing ceremonies, IC "how to make your golem work with you" training, and what have you. I'm oblivious to most of the issues being talked about up in this thread so I don't have anything to say about all that, but I look forward to seeing how things will go from here. Especially since I suck at PvP and I have specifically designed my character to be bad at everything. (I know this has frustrated other players here OOCly before.)

Before I ramble any further, I guess my point is that I've been waiting to get involved with more Teradrim/Earthcaller RP for forever so if there were people looking for this sort of content, I'd love to lend a hand. I participated in that shop desc contest, too.

Tetchta

Ruqayya said:

the worst thing you can do is join an unmoderated server for a MUD.

Someone put this on a poster.

Nipsy

...
@Ruqayya I love that your character is bad at everything....admittedly bad. I have been wanting to absolutely have some more interaction with you, because the interactions have intrigued me, also, we will have some fun things coming in the future, just takes a bit of fleshing out, so we can dust off those RP chops together.

Excited to see what comes.

Tetchta

Ruqayya said:

I came from a very RP-heavy game so I'm still adjusting to the lack of interaction that happens coming across people wherever but I understand that not everybody prefers to RP in the same way as I do and not everybody is interested in RPing with me, period.

I will say, on this note, even though it's not really fully on topic with the thread, but every time I think about possibly approaching Ruq for RP, you're fishing or doing beetles; that's perfectly great and dandy! That said, in this game in particular, most people, if they see you doing those things, they'll basically not interact with you at all, since it's usually something someone does when they're not super invested in doing anything else. Maybe it's just bad timing on my part, though!

Ruqayya

Tetchta said:

Ruqayya said:

I came from a very RP-heavy game so I'm still adjusting to the lack of interaction that happens coming across people wherever but I understand that not everybody prefers to RP in the same way as I do and not everybody is interested in RPing with me, period.

I will say, on this note, even though it's not really fully on topic with the thread, but every time I think about possibly approaching Ruq for RP, you're fishing or doing beetles; that's perfectly great and dandy! That said, in this game in particular, most people, if they see you doing those things, they'll basically not interact with you at all, since it's usually something someone does when they're not super invested in doing anything else. Maybe it's just bad timing on my part, though!

Yeah, no worries about that. Honestly, whenever I'm doing beetles/fishing, that means I'm busy doing work stuff. I typically park my butt in a tavern or some other place and turn on ROLEPLAY ADD otherwise. My hours are terrible, as I said. It's frustrating but hopefully I'll be able to figure out a good enough flow somehow through my work hours. That or just pour it all out on weekends.

Xolotl

So to everything that has been said, we have established the Teradrim guild has been in a stink last couple years, and now on a rise. For this I am happy I have retired and came back retired and came back each time same thing that was happening in the past keeps on happening and ongoing. On a new note since creation of Xolotl I have seen great and promising things happening in the guild. I am happy how it’s coming along thank you to everyone who has got the guild where it is from teradrim of old and of new. 

Macavity

Xolotl said:

So to everything that has been said, we have established the Teradrim guild has been in a stink last couple years, and now on a rise. For this I am happy I have retired and came back retired and came back each time same thing that was happening in the past keeps on happening and ongoing. On a new note since creation of Xolotl I have seen great and promising things happening in the guild. I am happy how it’s coming along thank you to everyone who has got the guild where it is from teradrim of old and of new. 

so what, exactly, has changed? From where I sit, scrolls were updated, a new characters have joined but seemed to have faded a little, there has only been a few people promoted up in the guild, still waiting on this new ritual being worked on, nothing has been posted further on the battlefield side of the guild, in fact the person who is in charge of that is hardly ever in Earthcaller or Teradrim.

Nipsy

Most likely the negativity from the leadership being pushed aside, and the encouragement of inclusion and working with our fellow guilds and City as a whole.
May be biased on that regard. But it is well known fact, that one does not require to be of a class to represent a guilds idealism.
Perhaps that is -another- thing you wont get, and be defensive and rude about.

As I told you IC, you are welcome to leave if you want to be consistently negative and not contribute anything. @Macavity
You can take your casks when you go. (Since that has been your concern you have brought up....repeatedly) I will buy some to replace them.

..and before you go and clutch your pearls over this...your posts throughout this thread have already proven well enough why people likely didn't enjoy the Teradrim previously.

Making demands and setting ultimatums of the current leadership while opting to not contribute to meeting goals and being generally toxic as a character and player can and will get you removed from the Teradrim, so I would choose wisely what you want to do with Macavity IC, because as of current, he's on thin ice for his behavior, and I have made this clear to him IC. Might be time to make some character development decisions, as maybe the guild isn't a good fit.

Lim

Macavity said:

Xolotl said:

So to everything that has been said, we have established the Teradrim guild has been in a stink last couple years, and now on a rise. For this I am happy I have retired and came back retired and came back each time same thing that was happening in the past keeps on happening and ongoing. On a new note since creation of Xolotl I have seen great and promising things happening in the guild. I am happy how it’s coming along thank you to everyone who has got the guild where it is from teradrim of old and of new. 

so what, exactly, has changed? From where I sit, scrolls were updated, a new characters have joined but seemed to have faded a little, there has only been a few people promoted up in the guild, still waiting on this new ritual being worked on, nothing has been posted further on the battlefield side of the guild, in fact the person who is in charge of that is hardly ever in Earthcaller or Teradrim.

Woah, this post really corroborates quite a bit of what's described in the thread, tbh.

Iazamat

I 100% support shoving aside and burying oldbie mentalities that don't - and haven't - contributed to the game and its orgs in healthy ways, so it sounds like the Teradrim guild has improved massively with a few simple changes. Things can only continue to get better from here, so long as activity is encouraged and fostered. Good on you, Nipsy!

Kurak

Macavity said:

so what, exactly, has changed? From where I sit, scrolls were updated, a new characters have joined but seemed to have faded a little, there has only been a few people promoted up in the guild, still waiting on this new ritual being worked on, nothing has been posted further on the battlefield side of the guild, in fact the person who is in charge of that is hardly ever in Earthcaller or Teradrim.

I am going to treat this as if you are actually curious and hope that you are not continuing a rather ugly trend of behavior. We have had three org requests over the last month(?), that is 3 more than had happened in the previous...well further than the records go back..so let's say previous five months. Now the rest of the your angry rant seems aimed at me specifically. If you had missed it this real life month was full of y500 events! Our combat people have been extremely active with duels, lessers, and other game events.

Now let's chat about my class choice because you seem really interested! Now if you did not know or notice I am going for level 200! So I have been spending most my time in my preferred bashing class. But do not worry! I will probably switch it up when I hit 200! I am closing on that goal!

The 'ritual' as you call it have been bounced around between the leadership and currently fell on the backburner with all the y500 stuff and real life. But do not worry! We will get it done in the next week or so. Also feel free to contribute! It will make FOUR org requests in less than a month of leadership change!

Overall, I feel the Teradrim are doing great! We have new members and everyone seems excited and the overall mood of the guild seems to have improved for the better barring a couple hold outs....*cough*

Nipsy

Honestly, can I use this platform to say....

y500 games have been awesome, I think a Teradrim placed in nearly each event, sometimes multiple of us!!

@Gallard - Amazing member of the guild, won numerous y500 events - Also got recognition for each event by City and guild, with the new education curriculum including advancement.
@Sheryni - Won numerous events and participated in numerous others, same as above
Myself - Also placed in numerous events, exciting times...
@Kurak Also did well in numerous events, same as above with ranks
@Ioai - Got promoted to Shaper when Macavity stepped down and subsequently Fyrren had to, supporting them by working as a team, not some role we have to fill, equal responsibility amongst leadership, we are one team, for one guild.
@Ruqayya - Much to her chagrin, often recognize her for her RP, she keeps things neat and orderly and always has fun feedback, I really want to chat with her more
@Xolotl - Exciting newer member, resident EarthMonk, had some fun RP with them making them undead, and a great active member of the guild.
@Amarita - Been doing wonderful keeping our shop stocked, and communicating, really has been wonderful getting to know her more
@Mephistoles - Has offered to help and provided insight, we usually have a brief chat when they are around, its been nice getting to know them.

We have a few other novices I am keeping an eye on, but also lots of folks interested in undeath and discussion about Azvosh, which has been fun.
Ilyen, Turken, Zansara, and Pahani, while I hope they come about more, sometimes things don't work out, but if they do come back, I look forward to it.

I miss Fyrren, honestly bummed that real life dragged them away for a bit, but they were always lovely and never negative, and always providing me feedback or suggestion.

So, for things being done, people being involved, and positive interactions, i'd say we're doing great
Also Kurak, there's a bunch going on and we have pending OrgReq's like I told you, for the sanity of our volunteers and admin, just keep a draft handy when we have a slot open.
No rush. I have heard your ideas and I love your vision.

Tetchta

I'm sorry are we policing what class people play now as relevant to guild RP?

Lin

Macavity said:

... in fact the person who is in charge of that is hardly ever in Earthcaller or Teradrim.

Man please do not trot out this mentality. It's such an Old Aetolia way of thinking. Using a different class for a day driver doesn't mean anything, it's not as if you're not racking up Leadership Points by sitting in the class that matches the guild. It's totally irrelevant to the rest of the complaint.