Ankyrean Anguish - Aetolia-based RAGE

Camille

I think that's the point, though, is that you save them for later.

Tahl

Rage at extended breaks.

Rage at newbie syndrome.

Rage at not knowing anything about any of the current events.

Luna

Call me mad, but if someone came to Spines with spirit classes tucked away disabled instead of forgetting them, I'd be questioning their real desire to get in from the get-go. It's no fun helping citymates out who end up treating your org as a convenient vacation.

The disabled classes thing wouldn't make it easier to hop in the first place, it would just make it easier to hop repeatedly, which isn't a good thing. Can't we consider upping the lessons you get back from dropping a class instead, maybe from 50% to 66% or something?

Damonicus

I would modify the tethered like Haven said. .  If you are in Enorian only x classes work. Eventually even with side hoppers the IG ramifications are going to hit them regardless. For me, if someone is willing to shell out the money for the slot and lessons, let them have i and keep it sealed as long as they are in an org conflicting of the skills.

Haven

Alexina said:

I'm not sure why we need to punish people for switching sides when this is a social, roleplay-based game. I've personally considered switching sides since tetherings were released (which must be close to a year and a half ago), but it just is not possible the way things are now. People say a lot of good things about Spinesreach - and I guess there are a lot of good things about Spinesreach - but it never really felt right for me.

Anyway. If we start asking for credits because people switch sides, we might as well make it cost credits if you want to switch guilds or cities, too. Because one week they might be Spinesreach aligned, the next Bloodloch.

Basically, the difference is in the past you could switch sides anytime. No credits loss involved at all; a sciomancer could move to Duiran and it would cost them nothing, a paladin could move to Spinesreach and it would cost them nothing. If this was not an issue back then, why would these people suddenly have to start paying credits for it now? Or, uh, why would the Syssin (or any other neutral-tethered class) have to pay credits to move around? Why would there even be a credit cost for joining a city at all, for any reason whatsoever?

The only thing that has changed is that you now -have- to quit any non-tethered classes you might possess to join the other side. Simply disabling classes instead outright forcing you to quit them is still a loss of 'credit value' for as long as you remain on that side. But at least if things don't work out, you could go back without having lost so many, many, many credits. I guess this is the point I don't get: why would we try to make people lose so many credits just because 'I don't like that you switch sides too often'.

Combat balance. Which is understandable in its own right. They didn't want to worry about Druid/Teradrim/Indorani hinder teams and the like running around smoking one side when they're trying to progress one side to match the other. (It's still possible actually via rogues but I imagine the Admin will punish those who try to circumvent the system like that. But that's speculation, don't believe they actually made a ruling.)

Haven

Luna said:

Call me mad, but if someone came to Spines with spirit classes tucked away disabled instead of forgetting them, I'd be questioning their real desire to get in from the get-go. It's no fun helping citymates out who end up treating your org as a convenient vacation.

The disabled classes thing wouldn't make it easier to hop in the first place, it would just make it easier to hop repeatedly, which isn't a good thing. Can't we consider upping the lessons you get back from dropping a class instead, maybe from 50% to 66% or something?

Precisely what Damonicus said. The IC ramifications will/should be severe enough of a deterrent for those kind of behaviors. And if it's a repeat offender or someone who manages to slip between the cracks and screws you guys over/wastes your time, all the more reason to make IC ramifications even more severe (like bounties or perma-enemy status or the like).

Aldric

Woah, talk of side-hopping? Step aside ladies and gents, I'm a pro here.

I truly do not like the idea whatsoever of charging credits to be able to switch sides, unless I'm getting a full lesson refund. Assuming you've got tri-trans, giving up one class equates to a 450 credit loss, and this is without even counting having to give up any artifacts that may now be useless to you, plus 100 credits possibly for reincarnation to a statpack that works for your next class. Have more than one class you have to give up? Take that 450 credits and multiply it by however many classes you have.

Kerryn said:The one downside I can see to this is people switching sides FAR to often. One week they are spirit aligned, the next shadow. To combat that, I think we should pay a certain amount of credits to switch. Each time you switch it gets higher with the frequency in which you do. The longer you remain on a side, it slowly lowers till it's back to the base amount set to switch. 

This is nothing to worry whatsoever about. Seeing as Aetolia is a role-playing game, your actions carry with you and you'll develop a reputation that sticks with you for this.

Again, speaking from experience, you can only switch sides so many times. I have yet to be in a city within the game that does not base citizenship highly upon popular vote; If you've swapped sides a bunch of times, chances are the citizens will say, "They've been here X amount of times/there X amount of times, who's to say they will stay? No."

The only way to bypass the above is by waiting/staying stable for a long time- and sometimes that doesn't even help. 

I personally don't see why people should discourage side-hopping as players, or even mechanically. If somebody decides they'd like to join another city, they're the ones that will pay for their actions IG, and trust me, they do. If they're willing to deal with the repercussions, nobody but them should have an issue with that.

Haven

Aldric said:

I personally don't see why people should discourage side-hopping as players, or even mechanically. If somebody decides they'd like to join another city, they're the ones that will pay for their actions IG, and trust me, they do. If they're willing to deal with the repercussions, nobody but them should have an issue with that.

Let's ignore role-play for a second. When you join an organization, as a player you are essentially saying that you are interested in contributing something to that community. As such the community should be responding with giving you their time (if not then someone is doing something wrong somewhere and that someone might be you too). When you're frivolously hopping between communities you are essentially wasting whatever time they invested in you because you ended up leaving anyway. And no one wants their time wasted. Plus there's the whole fear of metagamers and the like but that's a different issue entirely and I'm not going to get into that here.

It's fine when you are a newbie/recently out of torpor/or in the organization's trial phase (below GR 3 or within a Congregation or something similar) because you're expected to be trying to find your bearings. However, once you're established? Once you've laid down your roots? You've got a little more responsibility on your hands.

Haven

That's not to say you can't join/leave whenever you want! That's perfectly your right. Just saying that's usually the reason it is discouraged. The community is trying to protect themselves and their time.

Meyvitch

Can we move this conversation elsewhere?

My rage tonight is...being too wiped from work to log in more than 30 min. Or even stay awake for Men in Black 3.

Arbre

I'm not sure if this should be here or the other, but oh well.  I have bipolar, and I'm fairly well medicated (as anyone who's known me these last few years can attest to), but I still have problems.  This week's is that I'm losing sense of reality, which means despite how excited I finally am about playing the game and being involved again, I might have to step back for a little until this clears up - Aetolia!=RL.

Nola

Why can't everyone just love one another.

Or at least show some level of decent respect to another human being?

Its just a game. 

Aren

A******* who offend you on an ooc clan, then issue you when you call them a t***. Get a life.

Daskalos

To follow that up, it's a game. Just because someone doesn't play it the way you think it should be played does not mean they're playing it wrongly. Seriously, play the game you want to and let other people play it how they want to.

Eleanor

Though as an addendum to that, if you're playing in a way that's actively wrecking other people's play experience, maybe you ought to step back, because it's just a game for everyone who's playing, not just you*.

...Not that I'm passive-aggresively getting at anything or anyone or anything like that. It's just a consideration (or lack of) that bothers me sometimes.

*'You' in this case not being anyone in particular. General comment.

Daskalos

Being in a clan and not having the channel on, as was the case here, is not ruining anyones experience.

Eleanor

Oh, yeah, not commenting on the particular situation at all- got no idea what that's about! Just a general thing.

Isto

You take a hunting boon token from a cryptic chest.

And about 30 seconds later.

You are dismayed as a hunting boon token turns to dust in your hands.

Daskalos

I'm going with bug...?

Illikaal

Aren said:

A******* who offend you on an ooc clan, then issue you when you call them a t***. Get a life.

^ posts like this are what gets this forum closed on a regular. 

My deep seated hatred lies with the lyre artifact. Kill it with fire.

Lin

Aren didn't name names. I'd say it was a pretty tame thing to post.

Daskalos

Though, if you're wondering who the person Aren was talking about, I'd say he just made himself fairly obvious!

Kiyotan

Moving on.

Daskalos

People who see one group of people doing RP and go 'oh, look, they're RP'ing, let's go attack them'. Seriously?

Valenae

I think it was a good thing this thread was closed in the past. It seriously cut down on the amount of drama and butthurt. Maybe we should consider closing this thread down at some point. 

Daskalos

Eh, I disagree. People just ranted on IRC instead. You know who you are. You think I'm not there, but I am.

Borscin

(bounties)

Daskalos

Oh, I know why. I have no issue with the why. It's the whole 'they're RP'ing so let's do that now'  when it's not like I've exactly say in Enorian. I bash -all- the time.

Valenae

There's nothing said in IRC that wouldn't be said directly to you. Also, this is a vastly different dynamic (not to mention communication medium) than an IRC room. Don't be dramatic. 

Borscin

You have a hood, hard to see when you're bashing  

Also, you can't really complain. Remember running into the Black Keep and forcing me to attack Llazuth, Iosyne's new priestess? That is probably way worse too, since it abuses enemying mechanics and ruins everything in an IC and OOC fashion, were at least we are just being evil dewds attacking people for bounties. It had nothing to do with whether or not you were RPing.

Also, good show with shouting about being fought alone and then attacking Dourif with Aren. Granted, I already know you're a hypocrite, so I'm not surprised by any of this.