Lore questions.

Erzsebet

One person having it doesn't -necessarily- mean the lore is cool with it.

Not knocking his RP, by any means, I'm sure he's got completely legit reasons and all that. Just saying the existence of one, doesn't by default make it kosher?

Which mostly, that's what I'm asking. Lore-wise, is it kosher?

I kind've think it should be, because azudim was ret-conned to be kosher for the light-side, but at the same time, the helpfile says "A Yeleni is a mortal who has chosen to fight for the preservation and protection of life, adopting a higher physical form unlike any other that grants them great ability and power in their endeavor." preservation and protection of life--seems to me that the preservation bit would preclude vampires.

Ishin

I don't really pay much attention to the help files anymore, tbqh. They're dated as hell, just like a crapload of AB files.

Obyn

As far as I know, and I welcome another admin to correct me, but there is no good lore reason why a vampire could not be a Yeleni. Remember - Azudim is NOT directly related to undeath, it is however related to -death-. Dhar encourages his followers to be Azudim. Historically, yes, Yeleni have been supported by life-aligned gods, as Azudim has been supported by undeath-aligned gods. But that doesn't mean that you -can't- have a Yeleni vampire. Bloodloch might get their proverbial knickers in a twist over it, sure, but that is their prerogative.

Lim

THANK YOU. I've always felt that a yeleni vamp could be justified on an subjective interpretation that life is preserved by living forever.

Sarita

Or protecting their own food source, maybe.

Draiman

When I first came back Serrice tried so hard to make me go Yeleni vamp. >.>

Serrice

And I don't know why more vampires don't! You didn't embrace to become the embodiment of death, you turned so you could have eternal life! (and superpowers. but I think it was originally eternal life)

Obyn

To be fair, the embrace message is very, very explicit in the fact that you do die as it happens.

Toz

Well, we never said they did a good job of trying to stay alive forever.

Erzsebet

Bloodloch is the reason most vamps don't. Most of mine wouldn't, because they'd assume Abh would flip his shit over it.

I almost did, as Kiralla, but she didn't want to lose the Bloodborn/Bloodloch over the choice.

Ghend

Disclaimer: this is an opinion post, not a ruling on lore validity! It's an interesting question.

There are some issues with the idea of a Yeleni vampire, but it would not be intrinsically impossible. Vampires (and other undead) have a surplus of Shadow displacing their Spirit (a working simplification), and Shadow corrupts Spirit into a version of itself over time - someone with a core of Spirit-aligned Divine essence would likely get quite sick fairly frequently as their internal makeup shifts around, and they would would possibly suffer sudden and violent fluxes. They may even require infusions of Spirit energy from exposure to the sun or a God to stop their internal biology tearing them apart! It sounds like it could be quite an intriguing role to explore.

Obyn

Dem elemental mechanics, am I right? I agree that it would be a very, very interesting sort of roleplay.

Erzsebet

Is there any precedent for bonds forged with essence and a physical anchor of sorts, beyond that of gods and their shells?

Aishia

Well I don't really know what your question means, Aishia's heart is made out of Auresae's essense imbued into a hunk of Emberite.

Obyn

Erzsebet said:

Is there any precedent for bonds forged with essence and a physical anchor of sorts, beyond that of gods and their shells?

If you're asking if inanimate objects can contain some of a gods essence? Well, yes, a god can invest a bit of essence in an inanimate object.

Erzsebet

Mean essence more in the sense as that which mortals interact with directly, not divine essence.

Ishin

Obyn said:

Dem elemental mechanics, am I right? I agree that it would be a very, very interesting sort of roleplay.

I always wondered why Jensen was a cannibal, cookin' up fried Grook legs and deep-fried Atavian wings. Gotta keep that Spirit element in himself a little pure so he 'don't git sick'.

Obyn

Erzsebet said:

Mean essence more in the sense as that which mortals interact with directly, not divine essence.

To my knowledge no. However, I could very well be wrong.

Azzello

So how do Trolls tend to feel about Orcs and Ogres? I know the Orcs and Ogres have somewhat a comaraderie not just because of Chakrasul, but because they faught along side each other in many situations. Help files don't really tell much about the Trolls, they didn't go in to take over Dun Valley and nothing was mentioned about them being enslaved alongside the other two races, it just mentions they were created Chakrasul and that's about it.

Obyn

The orcs, trolls, and orgres are somewhat distantly related. Trolls will often look at members of the other two races as 'cousins'. Likewise, they have a very tribal society.

Areka

Yep, Cousins, they share similar roots in their languages and cultures (with overlaps in words and phrasing though different stressors and so on). They tend to rally around each other when in community, given the shared history and the shared reception amongst the other humanoid races (often times referred to as pig men or leatherskins derogatorily).

Ignotum

Even though the Trolls never really lived in Dun, they were likewise oppressed by the Indorani and later by the Ankyreans (who, to be fair, pretty much oppressed everyone). As mentioned, Trolls, Orcs, and Ogres get along and have a camaraderie that they don't really share, on a racial or cultural basis, with other races. They also all have their creation by Chakrasul and their subsequent 'redemption' in common, in addition to clear linguistic and cultural ties - that is, they've typically shared similar modes not only of language and culture, but also of thought and religious worship. Chakrasul tends to assume a central antagonistic role in much of their mythology.

Of note, the term 'Dunnite' is often used to denote an Orc or an Ogre. It's an inclusive term that directly points to their shared point of origin from Dun Valley, used primarily in the Enorian diaspora.

Areka

So, are Undead able to form (lore-wise) a closed-loop the way Living do? I've been informed that you can dissect Undead for curatives which suggests that, since they just reform bodies, they are a renewable resource.

Teani

Quite some time ago Teani was approached by Ezalor about allowing Yeleni so long as they are part of allied organizations. They would have to pay a simple administrative fee, or fine if you will, to correct the enemy status and then it would be all good. Teani even made a post about this to Spinesreach after being told to spread the news.

I don't know what's happened with that whole thing, but perhaps speaking to @Ezalor about it might be a good idea? Seeing as the official stance has changed, perhaps the laws should be altered accordingly. Makes for less confusion.

Alexina

Why can't we just have more playable races? Orcs, ogres, goblins, fae, et cetera. So much lore in the game and it just seems like such an easy thing to add.

Lim

I've nominated didi for ankyrean. 

Dristin

Alexina said:

Why can't we just have more playable races? Orcs, ogres, goblins, fae, et cetera. So much lore in the game and it just seems like such an easy thing to add.

I think it's been said before that it is limited by higher up, but I could be wrong.

Obyn

That's what the answer has been in the past. Certain corporate policies have prevented us from having new races in the past.

Azzello

So whats the story behind the howling? What creature is it, where is that sorrow coming from?

Hadrak

Azzello said:

So whats the story behind the howling? What creature is it, where is that sorrow coming from?