shrinking playerbase - critically low

Irruel

Alaric, Candace, Eliadon, Erzsebet, Irruel, Kaldaka, Kodaza, and Vyxsis.
There are 15 people total online with 7 people that are hidden from you.


Sure, off-peak time. But um... that's disturbingly bad. Ignoring me, as I'm only online to see how many people are around, that's 7 people playing right now. And 7 hidden so well I can't see them (with a hood). Off plane I suppose.

Is it time to merge the planes as far as communication channels and QW are concerned?

I log into that, and I just log out again. There's simply no point playing.

Eowyn

This is off-peak time so that's literally how many people are on. There might be what, one person bashing in the Vortex. Maybe one in Albedos. But, at least Albedos can still be spoken to on normal channels. So, unfortunately, those are just realistic numbers for this time of the day.

Xavin

It's highly unlikely that people are chilling out on the chaos plane or on dendara. The hidden people probably are either in rooms that are concealed, like their havens, or are using gems of cloaking. Unfortunately those numbers are the reality of playing at certain times.

Kodaza

In my timezone (which is the only one that exists and you're all figments of imagination or fever dreams) it was 3:00 am. I do tend to idle in Aetolia when I'm fighting insomnia or watching LCK, but 3-5 am for me is that deadzone. People further east start waking up and being active about an hour or two after this post was made, in my experience.

Population is still pretty good at actual living hours.

Shachalai

Around peak hours there's usually a few dozen people on.

The population's been coming back up through January - a lot of people vanish through December and come trickling back. I think we're back to pre-December numbers and that's holding stable.

Toz

As a bit of a night owl, I've also found people who are active and playing then SUPER LOVE to do stuff cause it gets quiet and lonesome otherwise so if you see someone on and moving, bump into them?

Kodaza

Toz said:

As a bit of a night owl, I've also found people who are active and playing then SUPER LOVE to do stuff cause it gets quiet and lonesome otherwise so if you see someone on and moving, bump into them?

2 a.m. is a period of me finding excuses to visit every single person on WHO, just to see who actually responds.

Irruel

I know it's off peak times. I've been playing IRE (mostly Aetolia) during the Aussie evening for 18 years though - it's rarely been that bad in any of the games, if ever. The state of Aetolia right now in terms of content, classes, bashing, and however else you can measure it , is as good as it has ever been - possibly the best.

And yet in terms of popularity, it seems to be at an all time low. Last night wasn't a one time thing - I didn't just pop in for the first time in forever on a night that was really low by chance - I've been dropping in occasionally for a while now. Doing a bit of offline work on my gui and wondering why I'm bothering.

Perhaps havens need to be on plane - when the number are that low, the people need to be forced together. We'll never retain a newbie if there's no one in the guild they join. And that's assuming those people aren't just idling of course.

Toz

Those people in haven usually are idling .I do it myself sometimes, it's nice to come back to clan chatter/deathsight sometimes and catch up on what happened while I was asleep.

Game could def use an influx of players, but I'm not sure where they'd come from.

Kyna

It's nice seeing others concerned about the well-being of the community! However, let me ease your concerns a little.

- Through January, at peak, US time, we were regularly sitting at 70+ online players with some decent playtime for each. We peaked over 80+ for a day or two.
- That's pretty good for a month that is partially written off at the start with holidays leaking from December.
- We love new players! They ebb and flow. Our retention rate is reasonably good at the moment.
- Last night during major off-peak time, the game crashed, oops! So, people didn't log back on until morning proper because that's probably a sign you should sleep. Which is why it was unnaturally low day just gone.

Hope that eases the worry!

Xavin

In this thread: @Kyna admitting that she is the one that crashed the game.

Kyna

Well. @Razmael didn't give me enough cookies. So, we had a fight. AKA. Blame @Razmael or @Tiur.

Kelliara

Kyna said:

Well. @Razmael didn't give me enough cookies. So, we had a fight. AKA. Blame @Razmael or @Tiur.

Moral of the story: Keep emergency cookie stash on hand at all times to placate angry @Kyna.

Razmael

We investigated later and found that Keroc stole the cookies from the cookie jar.

Kalak

While on paper it is sound most of the time; the peak time player counts, play time counts generally do not give too much indication upon the effective activity within the game. Because there are far more variables then them such as;

-People who are hidden from the perception but do not AFK. (I fall in that category generally, I log off instead of AFKing)

-People who are AFKing most of time for one reason or another.

-People who log in not to play but to hang out in OOC societies to get their social kicks.

-Admin dependency: There is a certain type of player who will generally remain dormant but be quite active during events or when interacting with an admin(God or such). That is what one might call "Those green names are helping!" effect. I would call it as admin dependency. As the admin dependency increases, it will create gaps of perceived inactivity between such interactions and will reduce capability of players to push their "grand play".

-Connectivity of games: That is how interconnected game modes PvP, PvE and RP are. And how players perceive them. Depending on that perception you may have low amount of players but too much effective activity so your game may appear larger then it is or you may have large amount of players but far less effective activity so your game may appear smaller then it is.

There would be more considerations one can put into the equation but I have no intention to bloat this thread. Though do not think that I try to portray Aetolia in a negative or positive light, just sharing a bit of my observations on the matter.

Teani

I think it is quite unfair to counter @Irruel's concern about the off-peak population of the game with pointing out that peak hours are doing alright. There have been a lot of events scheduled around peak hours for years, and we have been quite a few who have pointed this out and asked for a change. It can be quite difficult to maintain enthusiasm when missing out on all the excitement everyone else manages to be part of.

Not showing a lot of concern for off-peak hours (or even making a joking comment about that being the time people should sleep) basically shows less care for people who are able to play the game those hours of the day. Wouldn't it be better if more attention was given to making sure the game feels alive all the time?

Granted, I've been worked to death the last few weeks (which wasn't anticipated), so I've had less play time, but I've noticed a steep decline in presence during my usual evening hours. I can still get some RP, but there are fewer people around, as if they are expecting more to happen at peak hours, so why bother?

Maybe something small, like sporadic Arena events in Esterport, or spontaneous double xp hunt hours now and then might make a difference to show some appreciation to the people who log in at those times? I don't know. Just trying to offer something of a solution along with what I perceive as a problem needing to be solved.

Zaila

@Teani I think it is perfectly reasonable to counter irruel's initial post with pointing out that peak hours are fine since his original post made no distinction and claimed the game in general has a "critically low and shrinking population": which isn't the case.

I don't know if hosting more events would encourage more european/asian/african/aussies to be more active in those hours that the bulk of the playerbase is sleeping or working, but it might be interesting to try! 

Tiur

Admittedly, the title here is so inflammatory most of Us didn't want to answer, for fear of getting crazy defensive.

We host things on EU timezones. A lot of Tanix stuff happened late (for US) so we could get it early over there. We CAN, however, do better. Which we will. I'm considering a command to show player numbers/regular logins for a given timezone and try to tailor a bit.

But seriously, with that title, @Kyna is the only one of us that kept a cool head.

Vyxsis

'shrinking'??
i'm so glad someone finally noticed how i've been trimming down, thank you

Kyna

I apologise if my quirky reply to a broad generalisation offended anyone.

It was my intention to ease your worries about the overall health of the game with the more commonly used, peak numbers. However, as an Oceanic staff member myself, I understand your concern and I have been trying to engage our “off-peak” times with interactions to give the game life during those quieter hours. 

Addmitedly, they are no lore-altering, grand scale events, only smaller things. However, @Tiur and the rest of the staff have expressed interest in bringing a little more to these times, as well. As above. 

An example is that in the celebrations just gone we pushed some events later to ensure a broader sense of inclusion towards our various time-zones and we even introduced events that you could partake in at any given time over the event.

EDIT: Alongside that, we try to leave any of the big, lore altering or large scale events for weekends so we can catch that “middle-zone” where our US and EU or Oceanic players tend to cross over, Maghak’s passing and Tanixalthas’ awakening being the most recent example.

Teani

I appreciate the responses, because I know how difficult it is to balance things. Would be nice with someone on the other side of the spectrum too. Can we get a Euro-Kyna?

Vyxsis

Teani said:

I appreciate the responses, because I know how difficult it is to balance things. Would be nice with someone on the other side of the spectrum too. Can we get a Euro-Kyna?

iirc my #InsideSource said they're deleting europe when numages go live

Xavin

@Vyxsis acceptable losses.

Mihaketi

If anything player counts have picked up since November/December when I played last.

Toz

Mihaketi said:

If anything player counts have picked up since November/December when I played last.

The obvious solution is for you to never leave us again.

AwoooOOOOoOooooooo

Mihaketi

Xavin

@Mihaketi YOU CAN'T TELL US NOT TO AWOO.

Runas

Irruel

Tiur said:

Admittedly, the title here is so inflammatory most of Us didn't want to answer, for fear of getting crazy defensive.

My apology about the subject. It honestly wasn't supposed to be. I love this game and want to play it. I'm lucky to get 10 hours a week in and it's all off peak. So I just read or try other games instead. 

To help player retention, particularly during off peak times, I was hoping for a discussion about ways to keep players closer. Making sure off plane players are visible. Maybe considering divorcing guilds from classes and therefore the number of orgs on each city.

@Tiur

Ishin

Recently a change was made to gem/veil in Achaea that I feel like would be popular here, especially considering the concerns made about population and the like. I'll c/p it here so you guys can see.


Gem of Cloaking remains activatable with TULAHUAR, but this gives:
- Activation removes owner from Who lists.
- 10 minutes concealment and an hour on cooldown.
- This is a per person cooldown and does not stack.
- Gem ownership will always remove the owner's location from Thirdeye.
- The gem functions innately and always when on Treacherous Planes.

Veil/Hood of the Sphinx is now a location tool:
- Grants FULLSENSE.
Monks or Blademasters who own veils will have a balance reduction on their innate fullsense
ability.
- Can FARSEE across planes and continents, these will give the room and area of the target.
- Now costs 2500 credits.

Toz

Please God no I bought those things specifically to not be found, ever, at all. SCENT is fullsense, it's fast enough as it is, and I don't want to see across the 1 plane we have. I'm impressed Achaea did it, but it can stay on Achaea just like bards.