Iconic Skills

Tiur

It should be no surprise to you all that we are currently discussing/coding major changes to the Sciomancers and Ascendril. As such, I want to make sure I'm not changing things that are important to those classes.

While this is not the place to discuss changes to skills, or flavor, I am interested in hearing what you think are iconic skills that should just not be lost. I might even listen!

For example, if the topic were "Monks", you might put forth that monks just aren't the same coolness if we took out axekick.

Again, the topic for now is Sciomancers and Ascendril.

Aryanne

Crystalhome
It's just... So useful. Pretty please let it stay.

Kodaza

This is made a little challenging by so many of Sciomancy and Elemancy's skills being duplicates of each other with different flavor text. Are you asking about skills that are iconic about the classes individually, as distinct identities?

Tiur

Either.

Runas

I will argue against Crystalhome, as the Master Crystals are generally irrelevant now with the more recent crystalism changes.

I would be keen to see something akin to the Wayfarer's STARMAP, or Shaman SONGLINES as a replacement for it, were we could attune a location with vibrations to return to. In lieu of Crystalhome.

-SONIC PORTAL is something that is pretty mage-standard

-STORMHAMMER/ARCBLAZE is unique as it can target multiple targets, a multiple target skill is definitely something alot of other classes dont have and displays an air of power in a mages ability.

NOTE: Are these necessarily important - meh..not really, i just think they are favored skills of unique flair.

Kalak

-SINGULARITY/HOLOCAUST: Being able to blast away groups of people in such a violent fashion is very iconic. That is actually one of the few moments you feel like you are actually playing a Mage capable of causing some serious havoc.

-DELAY: This is more a personal taste maybe. By fiddling with it, you can really find some nifty tricks from time to time. Especially when combined with some iconic AoEs.

-STORMHAMMER/ARCBLAZE: I agree with @Runas on that.

-METEOSWARM and CLOUDBURST: AoE attacks/effects are iconic for Mages in my opinion.

-TEAM SUPPORT MODULE: One of the MAIN attractions of the Mage class is its usefulness to the group combat with its vibes. Of course with the emergence of 3rd skillset I cannot fathom what will happen to it, but a degree of team support would still keep the allure. It is iconic for them to be priority target in a skirmish, after all. Maybe I am a masochist.

Satomi

Being unable to wear armor is big a thematic thing

I don't magi much, and I'm not the biggest magi PKer around, but if you plan to keep the focus on elements being channeled, as long as the abilities are actually parts of that element, I'd be content.

Thematically, I like the Sciomancer's AoE focus. A lot of classes have aspects of aoe in their kit, but Magi just feels like a true AoE class with actual options towards aoe... even if some of those options destroy your teammates.

That said, I am rarely disappointed with the direction the administration goes with the classes/revamps I've been involved in.

I also like Holocaust. If that stays, I'd like to see it mirrored in Singularity, to provide more options/use of elements.

Kalak

Satomi said:

I also like Holocaust. If that stays, I'd like to see it mirrored in Singularity, to provide more options/use of elements.

My classlead regarding equalizing Holocaust and Singularity was approved. Though while it cannot be taken as an indication that will go through, Mages gotta have their explosions, right?

Xavin

Of the abilities that either mage class has, here's the ones I think are most crucial to their identity:

Holocaust/Singularity - These abilities tie into the archetype very well. Our own version of the D&D fireball.

Arcblaze/Stormhammer - multitarget, hard hitting, very core to the central idea of the Aetolian mage.

Sonicportal - Seems simple enough

Crystalhome - This ties into the mage archetype. I do like Runas's idea of making it something like starmap or songlines instead of binding it to the master crystal. Perhaps that's something that guilded magi could get as a perk, having the ability to home to the master.

Ifrit/Shadeling - Mages gotta dabble in summoning, but I would say that the form that summon takes could be open to debate. It might be interesting if the individual mage could customize their summon to some extent.

AoE effectiveness - This is another thing that made mage what it is. If it wasn't for crystalism, I don't think the Magi would have been split into two guilds in the first place.

Utility/Support - At one point, Magi had a ton more utility skills than they currently do. I remember more than a few mage players being upset at their loss of utility when Magi was split into Scio and Ascendril. It'd be a shame to lose them.

Ilyon

Holocaust/Singularity, and, well, that's it, really, as far as "iconic" skills go.

The class has some other things, but none of them is really a major one. Portals should probably remain, as no other class has those, but beyond that I wouldn't worry too much about changing/removing things if they don't fit in. Vibes are sort-of unique, but they are also a very boring concept.

Teani

A version of Crystalhome would be suitable, but to say it is not a legacy is flawed. The Master Crystals, despite their recent changes, remain an important part of guild Lore. Magi are supposed to be able to return to defend their most precious artifact at any time, and as hinted in the latest event, Godglass is a sought after commodity.

Holocaust/Singularity - yes, elemental bombs with effects that reflect each element.

If anything, I would prefer if there were not too many things that are mirrored between the classes. They need to be separated, given distinct aspects that make them their own class, and being wholly entrenched in respective elements without cross-overs as best as possible.

Kerryn

Illusion - Can be useful for rp. Unsure if it's still used in combat.

Shachalai

The Master Crystals are important if only as legacy items - agreed with Teani.

Iconic skills that I would like to see preserved in a Mage revamp include the following:

• Crystalhome - whether in current form, or updated to be more like the Wayfarer's Starmap, Crystalhome should stay. Giving guilded mages the option of returning to their Master Crystal for free would be a great perk. (Yes, I know this isn't the thread for discussing changes.)
  
• Holocaust/Singularity
  
• Portals
  
• Stormhammer/Arcblaze
  
• Channeling the elements as a basis for stuff working
  

I think it's fair to say I am neutral leaning meh on everything else. There are elements of our skills - crystals, for example - that lack flavor in any meaningful sense but could be cool if they were reimagined a little bit.

Tiur

I like this consensus. Now, with Stormhammer/Holocaust/etc.. is it the actual skill, or the AoEness? I'm not looking to change the meat of the class too much, just what it looks like and acts. I should have explained better.

Like, channeling. That's a big debate with me now. I can keep it, or toss it. Not sure.

Shachalai

For me, the AoE-ness and things going boom is of prime importance in that regard. I can't speak for anybody else.

Teani

Channeling feels important if only because that's how we access the raw energy from the elemental planes. Interaction with the planes is what gives it strength, makes it something of a hazard, and sets us apart from other uses of the physical elements, like Slyphe and water, Teradrim and earth. It adds magic, and I believe that is what people coming to the mage guilds are looking for. More mysterious, wonderful, dangerous magic that can go boom (Tiur wannabes want to splode things). 

Kalak

Channeling as a theme is good since as a Mage you are drawing energy from the Planes themselves. The problem with channeling is that it is prone to be interrupted so easily. Take Shadowbrand for example, when you are capable of doing it by the skill (not via Voidgaze piling) possibly your enemy is already at your mercy where you may not even bother with the brand.

Though for other skills which have no combat implication, emphasizing upon channeling from the respective elements could be a theme worth preserving.

About the Singularity/Holocaust, AoEness and flexibility (who does not love some air-bombs) of the skill is the main allure. Though I happen to like the word "Singularity" as well, in my head the word itself gives the impression of an unstabilized time and space bending mass pulling things and ready to explode anytime.

Actually if we had an insta-kill which makes us compel people to throw themselves into a giant Singularity, I would feel right at home. But I digress!

Runas

@Tiur being able to call powers down upon multiple targets is what makes Mage always -feel- amazing to play.

I actually like to hunt with stormhammer, I cant say its necessarily the wisest choice, but being able to call down three attacks at once on enemies is one of those (I hope crit-chance RNG is good or im gonna get rekt) opportunities, it just demonstrates alot of the power the mage can conjure.

I like how its always been a rather powerful skill, but never has really seemed overpowered in its incarnation since I have played.

Teani

Channeling = the drawing of power, i.e channel <elements>, Simultaneity. 
Not a channeled skill that takes time to execute, like the brands. 

And as people have stated, AoE skills. 

Xavin

@Tiur for me when it comes to Stormhammer/Arcblaze it's not just the multitarget attack with decently high damage. It's the flavor as well. It's a sciomancer harnessing the fury of a storm in a raw display of power, or an ascendril doing the same with raw elemental energy from the plane of fire.

I definitely agree that elemental channeling (as opposed to channeled skills) is something that should definitely stick around. It's basically been the thing that has defined sciomancy and elemancy, and elementalism before those skills, since the magi guild was started.

Serrice

DELIVERANCE.

Illikaal

I don't mind singularities and holocaust globes staying, but if they do, I think their functionality should be changed entirely. Although it's a lot more bearable these days, the holocaust/singularity stacking cheese in teamfights has been and always will be extremely cancerous.

Fezzix

Nerf Cloudburst/Tsunami. Having to keep up icewalls as the only counter means I have to sacrifice eq constantly to avoid getting ejected from a room. Getting ejected from a room means I miss cure messages and lose locks from it.

They're like escape skills, but better because they're not limited by movement restricting afflictions. Full on paralysis (and maybe two broken arms?) stops it. Yes, they have to flood the room, but that's no big deal.

Tiur

Okay, we're just talking flavor here. I'm closing this thread for being a waste.