The Good, the Bad, the Ugly: Promotions

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Comments

  • TiurTiur Producer Member, Administrator, Immortal Posts: 921 admin
    Chocolate bags are on the Banned list. But I getcha! This year has had a lot of Hunter pieces, but I'll make them do the rounds again.

    I agree, something should be done about those piles of chocolates. Maybe I can make their usage times reset somehow, like smooshing a couple together.

    And thank you for your input! I'll go through your rolls on the prizes and see what happened. I won't blow hot air about luck until I go do all the math for you :)

    By the way, anyone who thinks things have gone unfairly, message me. It's my personal honor to check and make sure you were treated fairly.
    BulrokCzciborDrystinIesid
  • IesidIesid Member Posts: 97 ✭✭✭
    edited January 1
    I'd be a little less ornery if you had more safety valves like the cryptic chest pity timer. That pity timer ended up getting me a salvage out of a chest from a stocking - it took two? layers of gambling (and a technical failure, hence the pity timer) to get the only thing I wanted aside from gold/platinum prizes. The issue here isn't strictly about the gambling odds - it's what you're putting behind those odds. To be very specific here: we haven't seen a clearer way to access salvage in a while. It's all been very tiny chances within chances.

    Re chocolates specific: Maybe offer the chocolate holding bag in a future promo and make it a bit more plentiful?
  • IesidIesid Member Posts: 97 ✭✭✭
    edited January 1
    Oops doublepost.

  • TiurTiur Producer Member, Administrator, Immortal Posts: 921 admin
    edited January 1
    Chocolate bag is totes in the current promo. (the one that has chocolates inside, but you can save it. Not the one that makes infinite chocos)

    And yeah, I know about the salvage. Unfortunately it's a poorly performing promotion for not-Aetolia, so we typically only get it once a year. I have 99% control, that 1% is promotions. I treat it as a second tier currency, making it so at least there's a chance.
    Iesid
  • StineStine Member Posts: 154 ✭✭✭
    Tiur said:

    And yeah, I know about the salvage. Unfortunately it's a poorly performing promotion for not-Aetolia, so we typically only get it once a year. I have 99% control, that 1% is promotions. I treat it as a second tier currency, making it so at least there's a chance.

    I find myself a bit surprised that you can't show upper management the fact that a sizable number of people are interested in this one promotion item and that they, in turn, would deny you the ability to make money off of people buying lootboxes (or whatever other RNG gambling mechanic you use) with it as a main prize more than once a year.
    TekiasIazamat
  • IesidIesid Member Posts: 97 ✭✭✭
    edited January 1
    Tiur said:

    And yeah, I know about the salvage. Unfortunately it's a poorly performing promotion for not-Aetolia, so we typically only get it once a year. I have 99% control, that 1% is promotions. I treat it as a second tier currency, making it so at least there's a chance.

    I might just start putting the aside portion of my entertainment budget I would spend on Aetolia and wait for this promo, then. The issue is that I could be waiting a very long time (this is my problem) and in the mean time I won't be spending much on Aetolia (a problem we share, albeit for two different pain points). I know you hate hearing this specific argument for a myriad of reasons and by no means am I threatening to take my business elsewhere, but this is a sore point for me because the salvage artifacts are particularly powerful and also incredibly scarce. This creates a power imbalance that will eventually become untenable. I don't feel comfortable writing classlead reports to address these items until I have them in my hands to test or there's enough data from sources around me that I feel familiar with them.

    If you are going to lock salvage behind RNG and roll out a salvage promo once every year and a half or whatever, I'm really just going to have to make sure I go in HEAVILY on that - and that necessitates me not spending anything else on Aetolia until that point. These gambling promotions make me feel bad as a customer because the last few times I've bought in, I've felt very burnt and like I'm not truly getting my money's worth. This time, that 'burnt' was having too many chocolates to actually use all of them and otherwise getting very little value for the stockings I did open for myself - I also feel like my giftgiving to Aetolian friends was a tad crumby despite springing for better than Festive stockings.

    I value salvage higher than most other prizes offered by these promos. Please let me at least START artifacts with salvage not in my name. Please give us ANYTHING to get our hands on salvage aside from trying to snipe one another and make other people salty or feel bad. Next arti cart, just do a flash sale for a few days where you stick them in the Special section. Give us one salvage every Iron Elite tick. Let us buy them for a crazy amount of iron coins. LITERALLY ANYTHING would be better than what you're doing now, because it creates more frustrated customers than happy ones. You've told us that you have a tough time gauging their cost, but that's honestly no excuse - it's like a bunch of hungry customers banging on the door of a restaurant and the proprietor telling them 'yeah, idk what to put on the menu dudes, you're gonna have to wait'.
    StineIazamatDrystinBenedicto
  • TiurTiur Producer Member, Administrator, Immortal Posts: 921 admin
    Well, it's more that I admit they're better at business than me. I believe the concern is that a secondary currency is worth more as an addition than as a direct purchase. Like, get a salvage for 200cr bought, over just buying salvage. Now that I know this is such a sore spot, I'll discuss it with them more. Incidentally, salvage is valued at 200cr.

    I like random chance promotions, but not gambling. For instance, I loved crates/crowbars. You bought exactly the box of relic pieces you wanted. There was some chance to which pieces they'd be, but it wasn't random to get them at all! If you guys agree, we can see about doing more of that stuff.

    Gambling does continue to be the most popular, though. Most players are very quiet about their purchases, and I assure you, years of data reaffirms. If I offer item x for 300cr, we will earn more by offering a box with a chance of including that item for less $ than just outright buying it.
    Seurimas
  • IazamatIazamat Member Posts: 253 ✭✭✭✭
    I like random chance promotions, but not gambling.


    I understand what you're referring to, but this is purely semantics at best. Even if we have control over an aspect of the promotion (current wheel tokens, for instance), our return is still predicated entirely on RNG and, that's right, gambling that we'll get something of worth. The only difference between the two is the illusion of control we have.

    Gambling does continue to be the most popular, though. Most players are very quiet about their purchases, and I assure you, years of data reaffirms. If I offer item x for 300cr, we will earn more by offering a box with a chance of including that item for less $ than just outright buying it.


    This is hardly surprising. People love the dopamine rush of "what am I going to get!" It's why lootboxes in video games, despite the hatred for them, continue to do so well and the studios using them continue to fight against potential legislation and oversight of them. It doesn't really make them good or desired, though, it's simply a predatory exploitation of player impulse and lack of restraint. Does IRE actually have a contingency plan in place if lootboxes are regulated in any way?
    Iesid
  • TiurTiur Producer Member, Administrator, Immortal Posts: 921 admin
    I've prewritten a ton of code for showing percentages, reward history, etc. In case of legislation requiring transparency. I shared it with the other games even! But Matt is one the bleeding edge of laws regarding that stuff, being as he's usually a witness called to explain microtransactions and ingame content.
    IesidSeurimas
  • CzciborCzcibor Member Posts: 94 ✭✭✭
    I have already asked Tiur to look into my stockings for me, but I really wish they were closer to this month’s promo in terms of prizes. Salvage is great and we all want it, but barring that pure credits is actually just a much, much better “common” prize than chocolate, phylactery pieces, scrolls (which ascendril can’t use), iterators etc. The problem is these things are only valuable in scarcity, not when everyone gets more than you can use. 

    Even a bigger variety of relic pieces that people could actually use would already be a step up. Translocator, hunter's tools, talisman pieces/fragments, compendium pages etc are all much more interesting than repeated cosmetic piece #73.
    DrystinOonagh
  • SeurimasSeurimas Member Posts: 76 ✭✭✭
    I for one appreciate the drive towards known-odds games. I've got a script that estimates a key's value and watching that number trend higher before a reset is pretty enticing and seems as fair as could be.

    That said, I too feel the sting of the sugar high. Seems like everyone is like me and just wanted to sell them at a premium to the chocolate junkies, lol.
    Didi
  • JhinJhin Member Posts: 26
    Rare artifact auction?
  • RhyotRhyot BloodlochMember Posts: 490 ✭✭✭✭
    That only happens once every 2-3 years. And we just had one last year. 


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