Looking for more active discussion? Join our Discord at https://discord.gg/x2s7fY6
Best Of
Re: Class Viability pt. 2
Am I not surprised about the Team tiers being almost all of Spirit classes. >_>
Elene
5
Re: Class Viability pt. 2
Alright!
We've hit 31 voters, and I don't think there's likely to be anymore. So here is the tally! I've also included how each class has moved compared to their previous position.
SOLO TIER:
S Tier:
Sciomancer = 1 x 21, 2 x 5, 3 x 1, 4 x 1 (3) = 1.35 [+C]
Luminary = 1 x 21, 2 x 4, 3 x 3, (3) = 1.36 [+A]
A Tier:
Wayfarer = 1 x 17, 2 x 8, 3 x 2, 4 x 1, (3) = 1.54 [+B]
Indorani = 1 x 10, 2 x 13, 3 x 3, 4 x 1, (4) = 1.81 [==]
Teradrim = 1 x 11, 2 x 11, 3 x 2, 4 x 1, 5 x 1, (5) = 1.85 [+B]
Praenomen = 1 x 2, 2 x 13, 3 x 9, 4 x 1, (6) = 1.96 [+C]
B Tier:
Sentinel = 1 x 7, 2 x 12, 3 x 4, 4 x 1, 5 x 1, (6) = 2.08 [-A]
Shaman = 1 x 7, 2 x 11, 3 x 8, 4 x 1, (4) = 2.11 [-S]
Archivist = 1 x 3, 2 x 15, 3 x 7, 4 x 1, (5) = 2.23 [-S]
Zealot = 1 x 6, 2 x 10, 3 x 7, 4 x 1, 5 x 1, (6) = 2.24 [+C]
Syssin = 1 x 9, 2 x 10, 3 x 3, 4 x 5, 5 x 1, (3) = 2.25 [-S]
Monk = 1 x 7, 2 x 7, 3 x 7, 4 x 2, 5 x 1, (7) = 2.29 [-A]
Carnifex / Warden = 1 x 2, 2 x 18, 3 x 3, 4 x 2, 5 x 2, (4) = 2.41 [==]
Templar / Revenant = 1 x 4, 2 x 11, 3 x 10, 4 x 2, 5 x 1, (3) = 2.46 [-S]
Shapeshifter = 1 x 4, 2 x 8, 3 x 11, 4 x 5, (3) = 2.61 [==]
C Tier:
Ascendril = 1 x 1, 2 x 6, 3 x 8, 4 x 7, 5 x 3, (6) = 3.20 [==]
TEAM TIER:
S Tier:
Luminary = 1 x 20, 2 x 7, 3 x 1, (3) = 1.32 [==]
A Tier:
Monk = 1 x 16, 2 x 8, 3 x 4, 4 x 1, (2) = 1.66 [-S]
Sentinel = 1 x 13, 2 x 11, 3 x 5, (2) = 1.72 [==]
Shaman = 1 x 11, 2 x 14, 3 x 4, (2) = 1.76 [-S]
Carnifex / Warden = 1 x 12, 2 x 10, 3 x 6, (3) = 1.78 [+B]
Ascendril = 1 x 12, 2 x 6, 3 x 9, 4 x 1, (3) = 1.96 [==]
B Tier:
Sciomancer = 1 x 10, 2 x 10, 3 x 4, 4 x 2, 5 x 2, (3) = 2.14 [-A]
Praenomen = 1 x 7, 2 x 13, 3 x 3, 4 x 3, 5 x 1, (4) = 2.19 [==]
Wayfarer = 1 x 7, 2 x 12, 3 x 7, 4 x 2, 5 x 1, (2) = 2.24 [==]
Shapeshifter = 1 x 5, 2 x 13, 3 x 9, 4 x 2, (2) = 2.28 [==]
Indorani = 1 x 8, 2 x 9, 3 x 7, 4 x 3, 5 x 1, (3) = 2.28 [-A]
Templar / Revenant = 1 x 5, 2 x 11, 3 x 9, 4 x 3, 5 x 1, (2) = 2.45 [-A]
Teradrim = 1 x 4, 2 x 12, 3 x 8, 4 x 2, 5 x 2, (3) = 2.5 [-A]
Archivist = 1 x 6, 2 x 8, 3 x 8, 4 x 2, 5 x 4, (3) = 2.64 [==]
Zealot = 1 x 1, 2 x 10, 3 x 9, 4 x 3, 5 x 2, (6) = 2.8 [+C]
C Tier:
Syssin = 2 x 4, 3 x 10, 4 x 8, 5 x 6, (3) = 3.57 [-B]
I'll do a little commentary like I did before, so here's a quick take-away from this.
TOP AND BOTTOM DOGS:
The new champion Sciomancer (solo) has risen, taking the mantle from what I thought would likely be either Luminary or Wayfarer. This isn't too much of a shock to me, they have a lot of powerful forks and some of their best afflictions cannot be cured by random means. They also have great defensive means.
Luminary (team) takes the cup in over all other classes when it comes to teams. No other class stands in its tier. They have a huge variety of powerful team skills and a great ability to fortify their teams position. They're also pretty tanky and can pop a number of skills to live for longer. It's pretty hard to think of what they don't do well.
Ascendril (solo) sits at the bottom despite being a relatively new class. There were some things that were cut from the affliction side before release, as the limb side of things seemed really strong. Perhaps its time they got some of the missing skills.
The position of Syssin (team) isn't unexpected. As an assassin class their theming and feel is supposed to be attractive to those who enjoy the lone wolf style of play. Having said that perhaps a few new tricks up their sleeve for teams couldn't go wrong.
INTERESTING POINTS:
There was a lot more people this time around who chose unsure as an answer. A little surprising, but with more voters compared to last time, I think its safe to say that just happens when more people chime in.
Templar had one of the biggest drops from S to B tier, despite their solo ability not really being touched much. Shaman and Archivist had similar drops, but they have been altered in their solo capacity.
Praenomen jumped up in solo, from C to A tier. The biggest change for them is likely the loss of a healing malus at low blood thanks to the Sanguine ability. The minion is also harder to outright kill. Sciomancer also rose but they are a completely new class compared to last time.
Teams mostly remained the same without too much of a shift. Less S tier classes however.
Finally, there was 13 voters from shadow, 14 from spirit, and 4 from both.
We've hit 31 voters, and I don't think there's likely to be anymore. So here is the tally! I've also included how each class has moved compared to their previous position.
SOLO TIER:
S Tier:
Sciomancer = 1 x 21, 2 x 5, 3 x 1, 4 x 1 (3) = 1.35 [+C]
Luminary = 1 x 21, 2 x 4, 3 x 3, (3) = 1.36 [+A]
A Tier:
Wayfarer = 1 x 17, 2 x 8, 3 x 2, 4 x 1, (3) = 1.54 [+B]
Indorani = 1 x 10, 2 x 13, 3 x 3, 4 x 1, (4) = 1.81 [==]
Teradrim = 1 x 11, 2 x 11, 3 x 2, 4 x 1, 5 x 1, (5) = 1.85 [+B]
Praenomen = 1 x 2, 2 x 13, 3 x 9, 4 x 1, (6) = 1.96 [+C]
B Tier:
Sentinel = 1 x 7, 2 x 12, 3 x 4, 4 x 1, 5 x 1, (6) = 2.08 [-A]
Shaman = 1 x 7, 2 x 11, 3 x 8, 4 x 1, (4) = 2.11 [-S]
Archivist = 1 x 3, 2 x 15, 3 x 7, 4 x 1, (5) = 2.23 [-S]
Zealot = 1 x 6, 2 x 10, 3 x 7, 4 x 1, 5 x 1, (6) = 2.24 [+C]
Syssin = 1 x 9, 2 x 10, 3 x 3, 4 x 5, 5 x 1, (3) = 2.25 [-S]
Monk = 1 x 7, 2 x 7, 3 x 7, 4 x 2, 5 x 1, (7) = 2.29 [-A]
Carnifex / Warden = 1 x 2, 2 x 18, 3 x 3, 4 x 2, 5 x 2, (4) = 2.41 [==]
Templar / Revenant = 1 x 4, 2 x 11, 3 x 10, 4 x 2, 5 x 1, (3) = 2.46 [-S]
Shapeshifter = 1 x 4, 2 x 8, 3 x 11, 4 x 5, (3) = 2.61 [==]
C Tier:
Ascendril = 1 x 1, 2 x 6, 3 x 8, 4 x 7, 5 x 3, (6) = 3.20 [==]
TEAM TIER:
S Tier:
Luminary = 1 x 20, 2 x 7, 3 x 1, (3) = 1.32 [==]
A Tier:
Monk = 1 x 16, 2 x 8, 3 x 4, 4 x 1, (2) = 1.66 [-S]
Sentinel = 1 x 13, 2 x 11, 3 x 5, (2) = 1.72 [==]
Shaman = 1 x 11, 2 x 14, 3 x 4, (2) = 1.76 [-S]
Carnifex / Warden = 1 x 12, 2 x 10, 3 x 6, (3) = 1.78 [+B]
Ascendril = 1 x 12, 2 x 6, 3 x 9, 4 x 1, (3) = 1.96 [==]
B Tier:
Sciomancer = 1 x 10, 2 x 10, 3 x 4, 4 x 2, 5 x 2, (3) = 2.14 [-A]
Praenomen = 1 x 7, 2 x 13, 3 x 3, 4 x 3, 5 x 1, (4) = 2.19 [==]
Wayfarer = 1 x 7, 2 x 12, 3 x 7, 4 x 2, 5 x 1, (2) = 2.24 [==]
Shapeshifter = 1 x 5, 2 x 13, 3 x 9, 4 x 2, (2) = 2.28 [==]
Indorani = 1 x 8, 2 x 9, 3 x 7, 4 x 3, 5 x 1, (3) = 2.28 [-A]
Templar / Revenant = 1 x 5, 2 x 11, 3 x 9, 4 x 3, 5 x 1, (2) = 2.45 [-A]
Teradrim = 1 x 4, 2 x 12, 3 x 8, 4 x 2, 5 x 2, (3) = 2.5 [-A]
Archivist = 1 x 6, 2 x 8, 3 x 8, 4 x 2, 5 x 4, (3) = 2.64 [==]
Zealot = 1 x 1, 2 x 10, 3 x 9, 4 x 3, 5 x 2, (6) = 2.8 [+C]
C Tier:
Syssin = 2 x 4, 3 x 10, 4 x 8, 5 x 6, (3) = 3.57 [-B]
I'll do a little commentary like I did before, so here's a quick take-away from this.
TOP AND BOTTOM DOGS:
The new champion Sciomancer (solo) has risen, taking the mantle from what I thought would likely be either Luminary or Wayfarer. This isn't too much of a shock to me, they have a lot of powerful forks and some of their best afflictions cannot be cured by random means. They also have great defensive means.
Luminary (team) takes the cup in over all other classes when it comes to teams. No other class stands in its tier. They have a huge variety of powerful team skills and a great ability to fortify their teams position. They're also pretty tanky and can pop a number of skills to live for longer. It's pretty hard to think of what they don't do well.
Ascendril (solo) sits at the bottom despite being a relatively new class. There were some things that were cut from the affliction side before release, as the limb side of things seemed really strong. Perhaps its time they got some of the missing skills.
The position of Syssin (team) isn't unexpected. As an assassin class their theming and feel is supposed to be attractive to those who enjoy the lone wolf style of play. Having said that perhaps a few new tricks up their sleeve for teams couldn't go wrong.
INTERESTING POINTS:
There was a lot more people this time around who chose unsure as an answer. A little surprising, but with more voters compared to last time, I think its safe to say that just happens when more people chime in.
Templar had one of the biggest drops from S to B tier, despite their solo ability not really being touched much. Shaman and Archivist had similar drops, but they have been altered in their solo capacity.
Praenomen jumped up in solo, from C to A tier. The biggest change for them is likely the loss of a healing malus at low blood thanks to the Sanguine ability. The minion is also harder to outright kill. Sciomancer also rose but they are a completely new class compared to last time.
Teams mostly remained the same without too much of a shift. Less S tier classes however.
Finally, there was 13 voters from shadow, 14 from spirit, and 4 from both.
Keroc
12
Re: What class do you want mirrored next?
Dang Indorani is popular. I know at least one Celani who is now staring at me smugly across the internet.
Tiur
6
Re: RL Struggles, Strife, and Sadnesses
Hi this is an absence post. I couldn't find a section for absences but basically my life has been a spiral. I don't know when I feel like socializing with anybody which makes it hard to play game. I hope you're all doing good.
Life has been a constant struggle for me which makes it hard to play because I'm exhausted by 4 pm. Hugs. i miss playing with everyone
Life has been a constant struggle for me which makes it hard to play because I'm exhausted by 4 pm. Hugs. i miss playing with everyone
Maira
6
Re: What class do you want mirrored next?
Y'al sleeping on barndoorani where all of the ents are just barnyard animals and the tarot cards are different farming instruments.Please submit your Celani application immediately.
Brax
6
Re: Announce post #3176: Aegis and PK
The thing is, I never argued that actions shouldn't have consequences nor that all PK should happen with preceding OOC negotations, but somehow through some subjective hyperbole it's perceived as I did and here we are.I get what you're saying but I don't agree with it. Why should Aegis be treated any differently from shrines, traps, rites, wormholes or any other skill that could potentially give an enemy team advantage? Should Orders not be able to retaliate against someone dusting their shrines even if it is in a contested zone? Should shrines be restricted to non-major areas and cities only? Should we start dismantling all the wormhole networks in the game? Should we start attacking people on sight for laying down a trap or rite for the 'potential threat'? Even if said things haven't affected us? While, yes, a player can do any of those things, they'd be subject to retaliation without question but because "reasons" Aegis is exempt from this standard. Why is Aegis suddenly a special case?
I'll try one final time to explain my point of view but I really don't have the forum stamina to keep going at this.
As far as I understand, the argument that's laid out is this. "They attacked Nisavi's aegis." = Action, "Them being called out for a duel or hunted over it." = Consequence.
This, I disagree with it. In my eyes, the action is the first offensive move. Which is dropping the aegis at that very spot, and consequence is it being contested. Action-reaction, and it's over. That's where that content you asked for ends, and a new one begins. You can't pretend your actions to that point do not exist and just claim cause because people reacted to you and you can't say* what they did, was just the instigation.
For example, if you attacked a shrine and people defended it against you. That's all the content you could ask for. You don't then get to hunt people because they stood up against you. That makes no sense, to me at least. Or even better yet, if Nisavi attacked a shrine, got defended then left. Then dropped an aegis at the shrine for the next time he attacks it. And if that aegis* got contested. Does he have a cause on the people that try to clear the aegis? That example is as identical as it could get to this Orrery incident.
So in my eyes, you've no cause whatsoever in that situation. But I'm not the administration, so I'll just say, you are in a spot subject to administrative approval for your action because it's addressed in an issue. The thing I firmly believe with the issues is, (This is more directed at @Teani.) sure sometimes the reason you get issued for feels off. Sometimes, people go through rough days in their lifes and project their grievances into the game. Not the first time it has happened nor the last time it'll ever happen. But still, they issue people because they are uncomfortable in the game. That alone calls for some introspection from the issued party, it's not about winning or losing the issue as some people seem to make it all about. It's about empathy.
So, yes. If I am in a spot in which I've no cause for PK and I've had past experiences with involved parties being upset with my actions and on top of that I'm also worried about missing out on good RP/PK opportunity. I'd reach out to them and talk it out OOC before doing anything. That's as sound as an advice could get, imo. And I stand by it, still.
If you read my posts this far and none of this still makes sense to you, at least thank you for putting the effort to come this far and we can agree to disagree.
edit: corrected some words.
Both sides have access to Aegis. Both sides can choose to utilize the strategy and make their own choke points. Burned yourself out from fighting? Take a break and come back later! It's not going anywhere. Don't want to be involved? Then don't participate! These minigames aren't mandatory.
Ultimately it boils down to a group of players that don't want to have to deal with Aegis during a contention nor do they want to deal with being retaliated against for choosing to involving themselves in taking away someone's advantage.
Haven
5
Re: What class do you want mirrored next?
If they're from Dendara, doesn't that make them... outdoorani?
Alela
6
Announce post #3176: Aegis and PK
4/9/2021 at 14:34
Tiur, the Gnosis
Everyone
Aegis and PK
Formal rules, now enshrined in HELP AEGIS PK
The Aegis based skills provide a unique PK problem, due to them being tied to a location and capable of acting at nearly any time, regardless of the maker's presence.
1) If you are online and any aegis you own is being actively attacked you are allowed to defend it DURING the attack.
2) If your aegis is in a hotspot location, e.g. caravan routes, major hunting area, frequently used path, or Orrery area, you cannot take revenge for its destruction.
3) Anything else is open for revenge, such as a city, shop, personal residence, etc.
All of these rules are lesser than the greater PK rules and do not override them. So if it was (real life) weeks ago, move on. It needs to make narrative sense, and an Aegis isn't important enough to plot revenge for (in game) years.
Penned by my hand on Falsday, the 2nd of Lleian, in the year 494 MA.
Tiur, the Gnosis
Everyone
Aegis and PK
Formal rules, now enshrined in HELP AEGIS PK
The Aegis based skills provide a unique PK problem, due to them being tied to a location and capable of acting at nearly any time, regardless of the maker's presence.
1) If you are online and any aegis you own is being actively attacked you are allowed to defend it DURING the attack.
2) If your aegis is in a hotspot location, e.g. caravan routes, major hunting area, frequently used path, or Orrery area, you cannot take revenge for its destruction.
3) Anything else is open for revenge, such as a city, shop, personal residence, etc.
All of these rules are lesser than the greater PK rules and do not override them. So if it was (real life) weeks ago, move on. It needs to make narrative sense, and an Aegis isn't important enough to plot revenge for (in game) years.
Penned by my hand on Falsday, the 2nd of Lleian, in the year 494 MA.
