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I think there is a mentality now that any form of losing is toxic, and most people will do anything to avoid it. A couple of examples. I killed Ranae while in the Shattered Vortex. I could have killed Anahera, but left them alone (even though a PK zone) Why? Because that wouldn't be healthy for me to kill a young combatant like that. I didn't bring a squad, just me vs. Ranae. I did the same for every single member i could find outside of the city (at least five different Templars). What happened? They all ran or called for reinforcements.

I don't know how you can read that and get anything but 'wildly different expectations'. If that was an example of 'any form of losing is toxic', then I think it's a terrible example. Explicitly, he's stating that because people who don't fight on the regular don't 1v1 him, that that was toxic, and that's 'doing anything to avoid losing'. Really? The only person he cites as 'respecting' because they did stand and fight was Benedicto, and guess what? He's someone who Sects, who can be expected to ENJOY PK. But all the people who might not enjoy it as much, or 1v1 at least, they're toxic for not standing and fighting when they have absolutely no plausible chance of beating him 1v1? To go into something and expecting behavior that you should not reasonably expect, and then calling out the other people and disparaging for it is really bad form in my opinion.

I know you (@Haven) enjoy diving hopeless odds when you don't even have a chance for success by any definition (Carnifex training in Bloodwood/Tiyen Esityi, that one lesser near Spines), but I'm confident in saying that the majority of Aetolians prefer to have some chance of success before going into a fight. I'm confident in saying this based on the number of times I've seen spirit or shadow dive wildly outnumbered fights - on shadow side, I've seen Hawa poke around a few times and Nerakh once or twice just plain bum rushed us solo 3 times over. On our end, I've seen you and me, and I'm not going to solo dive unless I have a real solid plan and think I can snag a kill (a success, by some definition). But I do not think this is a common way of thinking, nor do I think that it should be misrepresented as 'you should be willing to throw yourself to the wolves to satisfy someone else' or that people should be implicitly judged for it, as it seems like a lot of people in this thread seem to be doing. No one likes losing, and to expect people to just fling themselves into the jaws of defeat to satisfy you is supremely arrogant and dickish.

We might have to agree to disagree on this.

When he says 'there is a mentality now that any form of losing is toxic', he's not saying those that don't engage him 1v1 are toxic. He's saying because people view the act of losing as toxic, they in turn then do anything they can to avoid it. Whether his examples are good/bad for the point is up for debate. And while the example does involve 1v1, the message wasn't about his ego.

I think there is a mentality now that any form of losing is toxic, and most people will do anything to avoid it. A couple of examples. I killed Ranae while in the Shattered Vortex. I could have killed Anahera, but left them alone (even though a PK zone) Why? Because that wouldn't be healthy for me to kill a young combatant like that. I didn't bring a squad, just me vs. Ranae. I did the same for every single member i could find outside of the city (at least five different Templars). What happened? They all ran or called for reinforcements.

I don't know how you can read that and get anything but 'wildly different expectations'. If that was an example of 'any form of losing is toxic', then I think it's a terrible example. Explicitly, he's stating that because people who don't fight on the regular don't 1v1 him, that that was toxic, and that's 'doing anything to avoid losing'. Really? The only person he cites as 'respecting' because they did stand and fight was Benedicto, and guess what? He's someone who Sects, who can be expected to ENJOY PK. But all the people who might not enjoy it as much, or 1v1 at least, they're toxic for not standing and fighting when they have absolutely no plausible chance of beating him 1v1? To go into something and expecting behavior that you should not reasonably expect, and then calling out the other people and disparaging for it is really bad form in my opinion.

I think you are completely missing the point. I am not calling them toxic for fleeing. I had the opportunity to bring in X amount of people to kill one person. If there is one major complaint I hear in almost all webs, clans, cities, discord, etc. is when people get dogpiled. When you adopt this type of stance, you are either going to get someone just saying, screw it, I don't need to PK them, or, you go get your curbstomp/dogpile crew and go after them. That is the behavior I am referencing that is toxic, and it is the one that happens the most. I could have done that, I chose not to. I chose to give some kind of chance. This right here --> "I didn't bring a squad, just me vs. Ranae." For example, a member was going into the Fracture doing their ylem gathering whatever. It is open PK, yes. However, (4) very formidable PKers went after said person and completely rolled them. That is the kind of thing I am trying to make go away. If you think that fosters any kind of positive PK, I don't know what to tell you. When I saw this happen, my first thought was to do the same back, but what does that solve? How are you contributing to a better culture?

No one likes losing I don't like losing, and to expect people to just fling themselves into the jaws of defeat to satisfy you is supremely arrogant and dickish.

FTFY

Also, I don't play really but can I point out coming as a combatant who was midling at best, that was expected to be antagonistic because they played a tether and had a role that required them to be, I went in on things ALLLL the time that I was not going to win.

The game would probably be more fun for everyone involved if people stopped worrying about it as a win/lose and instead approached it from the angle of a story. Which... is a tall order since the majority of the game does not actually play this as an RP game. Instead it's endless king of the mountain and people get upset when they lose since there's no story line being told.

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I mean from what I can tell here is the story thus far:
Templar's went after Iosyne's order and destroyed close to 30% of the shrines erected across Sapience dedicated to her. Her order was caught off guard, shamed and angry! Her Bloodletter went after those who sinned against Her, sending them fleeing back to their homes to garner help, but this was not enough to sate the blood thirsty, Maliveolent worshipers. No, they wanted more, the Templar would pay!

Word spread and many who had cocooned themselves away in the dark places they go felt the call for blood, a cry for war and awakened for a chance to worship as only the Malevolent's know how. Their sights were set on Damariel, the Templar's patron as a measure to side step the politics of protection city's often provide their citizens and guilds alike.
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When I look at it from a story angle, it's interesting! The Templars went after Iosyne's order during a time when not many were around, and low and behold, they woke a sleeping giant. I logged on and saw like SOOOOOO many names I hadn't seen in forever; so cool! I logged off because actually this entire story is getting metagamed to all hell because the players are reactionary and can't handle the stress of pvp; so uncool!

The game would probably be more fun for everyone involved if people stopped worrying about it as a win/lose and instead approached it from the angle of a story. Which... is a tall order since the majority of the game does not actually play this as an RP game. Instead it's endless king of the mountain and people get upset when they lose since there's no story line being told.

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I mean from what I can tell here is the story thus far:
Templar's went after Iosyne's order and destroyed close to 30% of the shrines erected across Sapience dedicated to her. Her order was caught off guard, shamed and angry! Her Bloodletter went after those who sinned against Her, sending them fleeing back to their homes to garner help, but this was not enough to sate the blood thirsty, Maliveolent worshipers. No, they wanted more, the Templar would pay!

Word spread and many who had cocooned themselves away in the dark places they go felt the call for blood, a cry for war and awakened for a chance to worship as only the Malevolent's know how. Their sights were set on Damariel, the Templar's patron as a measure to side step the politics of protection city's often provide their citizens and guilds alike.
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When I look at it from a story angle, it's interesting! The Templars went after Iosyne's order during a time when not many were around, and low and behold, they woke a sleeping giant. I logged on and saw like SOOOOOO many names I hadn't seen in forever; so cool! I logged off because actually this entire story is getting metagamed to all hell because the players are reactionary and can't handle the stress of pvp; so uncool!

A million times this.

Kind of a spoiler but ultimately, it is via cross-tether RP that this will all be brought to a close. Both parties, the Templar and Iosyne's Order have been amazing and in the privacy of communication between the two orgs, we've settled on an amazing conclusion. Oddly, the people who you would think would be the most angry and indignant at what I chose to do have actually been the most chill about it and have been great via both an OOC and IC medium.

I mean, hell's bells, @Mazzion even called me 'Fish and Chips!' again - that's not happened for a couple of years! (Completely OOC reference to me being British) and we've been reunited as 'Ed & Ted' (don't ask). @Tatia has also been utterly fantastic and a delight to work with.